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Justice For All

Atheists have our own ideas about what is just and what is unjust.  This group will explore the elusive concept of justice.  Topics include racial injustice, death penalty, imprisonment, crime, and other aspects of justice in modern society and in history.  Without gods, what is the basis for justice?  What do humanists and others say about justice?  What do you think about current controversies and cases regarding justice or injustice?

Members: 43
Latest Activity: Apr 9

Welcome!

Troy Davis's photo was chosen as this original icon for this group.  Davis symbolized inequality of justice in the US.  At the time of his execution, 9/21/11, the evidence supporting his conviction was flimsy.  There was known evidence supporting his innocence.  He was executed anyway. Since then the icon is changed to represent justice in general.

 

There are different nontheist points of view about justice, punishment, penalties, death penalty.   There is strong support for retribution and execution in the theist community (in the US).

 

What serves as "justice" is not distributed evenly across communities.  The most egregious injustice has strong racial overtones.  If you would like to read about, and discuss justice, what it is, who gets justice, and who doesn't, and stories relevant to this topic, please join and contribute to the discussions.

 

Resources

www.deathpenalty.org  factsheet.

www.deathpenalty.org  main page

deathpenaltyinfo.org  executed possibly innocent

amnestyUSA death penalty information

death row population (CNN)  sept 2011.

innocence project.  The innocent and the death penalty.

innocence project Wikipedia discussion

California innocence project

Chicago innocence project

Georgia innocence project

ThinkProgress/Justice

Discussion Forum

In the US, victims pay corporate criminals through taxes

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by tom sarbeck Apr 9. 1 Reply

On Burying the Torture Report

Started by Bertold Brautigan. Last reply by Daniel W Dec 9, 2014. 3 Replies

Black Panic

Started by Daniel W. Last reply by k.h. ky Sep 4, 2014. 7 Replies

Environmental Activist Hit Lists

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Grinning Cat Jun 30, 2014. 2 Replies

Harsher sentences increase crime

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Luara Jun 27, 2014. 4 Replies

Debtors Prison in the US

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Ruth Anthony-Gardner Jun 12, 2014. 4 Replies

Coal Ash contaminated water jail coverup

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner May 26, 2014. 0 Replies

Comment Wall

Comment

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Comment by Daniel W on August 9, 2014 at 5:28pm

Unfortunately, people carrying guns everywhere will make the vulnerable, more vulnerable.   I don't know much about Tupac, but his words there make sense in some ways.  I doubt that there have been psychological studies on gun carriers, but I bet they fit more into a bully or thug category, than the people who are feeling victimized and vulnerable.  The victims of racism are also the victims of white fear and, it appears, white gun carrying.  Recalling Trayvon,and  the 19 year old black woman who was murdered by a man on his porch, where she was seeking help, at least 26 children or teens in florida whose deaths are attributed to stand your ground.  I don't know the races of those kids in florida so can't include that, but the violence of the gun culture is still there.

I think we need is to cut back on the number of guns.

A couple of weeks ago another facility like mine had a gun incident.  Now they have special code announcements - like hospitals with code blue for someone not breathing, code red for heart attack, etc, there is code silver, for a gun incident. 

Comment by Joan Denoo on August 9, 2014 at 5:07pm

"I have been threatened a number of times and physically attacked a few times.  If people could carry guns there....  holy jesus, that's frightening."

~ Sentient Biped

I know men and women are vulnerable to thuggery, defenseless when faced with violence. With current cultural trends as they are, with little hope for some, Tupac, before he was murdered, defined thugs from his perspective: "a thug is someone who is going through struggles, has gone through struggles, and continues to live day by day with nothing for them". Even people who live in gated communities, with private police force, and access to legal protections, are not safe. 

The cost to our society is high and not improving. That is why the struggle for access to education and jobs is so very vital.  

Comment by The Flying Atheist on August 9, 2014 at 1:00pm

I really do get frustrated at the schizophrenic nature of the general public.  It's quite scary.  I sometimes wonder, as I personally try to make the world a better place, if I am in the minority. 

Comment by Grinning Cat on August 9, 2014 at 12:55pm

Thanks for sharing that... that result sounds disturbingly counterintuitive! (Evidence of extreme racial disparity triggering a fear of crime [at the hands of the "other"?], rather than outrage over injustice)

Comment by Daniel W on August 9, 2014 at 12:36pm

White oeople support harsher criminal penalties if they think more black people are arrested.

ThinkProgress.

In a way kind of fits the theme of today's report. 

"A recent study suggests that, if you are white, and you are presented with evidence that our criminal justice system disproportionately targets black people, then you are more likely to support harsh criminal justice policies than if you were unaware of this evidence. According to a study by Rebecca Hetey, a post-doctoral fellow in Stanford’s Psychology department and Jennifer Eberhardt, her faculty advisor, informing white people that African Americans are significantly over-represented in the prison population “may actually bolster support for the very policies that perpetuate the inequality.”

Bottom line - and this could include non-judicial execution by fear-based "self defense" in walmart -

"exposure to extreme racial disparities may make the public less, and not more, responsive to attempts to lessen the severity of policies that help maintain those disparities"

Carl, you are right.  And there is no way i want to be at Olive Garden with people carrying guns.  Or anywhere else.  My workplace is a "no weapon" environment.  I have been threatened a number of times and physically attacked a few times.  If people could carry guns there....  holy jesus, that's frightening.

Comment by Joan Denoo on August 9, 2014 at 12:26pm

Carl, Oh! my goodness! what a dreadful thought! A war sure to happen. 

I wonder if there are any counter-measures one can take? Maybe a celebration of community, or an expression of gratitude for the firefighters that battle all these blazes, or a thank goodness for science and the positive changes that evolved from it.

Comment by The Flying Atheist on August 9, 2014 at 11:58am

Within all the media coverage about open carry, I've seen only one black person, and he was with a larger group of white people.  Yes, I sure do wonder what would happen if 5 or 6 black men started walking around town in a group with AK-47's and rifles.  Imagine the scene that would take place inside Olive Garden or Red Lobster.   

Comment by Daniel W on August 9, 2014 at 11:41am

Well, some think there was a racial element.  "Why Black Men Don't Open Carry"

Comment by Daniel W on August 9, 2014 at 10:51am

Police shoot black man in Walmartfor holding a beebee gun for sale at Walmart. 

This week in "Gun Rights?"  Not that race had anything to do with it?

Comment by Ruth Anthony-Gardner on July 13, 2014 at 11:30am

 

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