Recovering from Religion

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Recovering from Religion

Unless you were raised by atheist parents, you probably had some recovering to do when you left religion. The purpose of RR is to provide a landing place for people when they jump from religion. With local support groups throughout the US, Canada, UK, and Australia, and real-time resources accessible to everyone, RR is where to turn when faith has lost its luster.

Website: http://www.recoveringfromreligion.org
Location: International
Members: 549
Latest Activity: Mar 1

Discussion Forum

Catholic Family / Atheist Wedding - HELP

Started by Megan. Last reply by Peggy Henderson Sep 1, 2013. 3 Replies

Any one else out there still recovering from Catholic guilt??I come from an extremely Catholic family/upbringing. In 6 days I will be the first person in my entire extended family not to marry a Catholic in a Catholic Church.My biggest source of…Continue

Anyone still deal with anything like this?

Started by Starland Victor Seay. Last reply by Matt Skaggs Aug 26, 2013. 27 Replies

One thing I have noticed is a tendency to "doubt" my new path in life. I still want to reach for the Bible sometimes. I still hesitate somewhat when someone mentions Pascal's "Wager"...LOL! Even though I know that science teaches this and that no…Continue

"Thief in the Night"

Started by cbenhamcox. Last reply by Luara Aug 18, 2013. 2 Replies

Last night I was reading Seth Andrew's book, Deconverted, and I almost fell out of my chair when he discussed being forced to watch the end times film from the 1970's call "A Thief in the Night."  He described some of the scenes, and I had a…Continue

Has it Been Easy for Anyone?

Started by Nathan Hevenstone. Last reply by Adam Valerius Aug 15, 2013. 9 Replies

I wonder if anyone who's gone from faith to non-faith has done it relatively easily? I ask because, for me, it's not really been that tumultuous. I guess it has a lot to do with my upbringing. Despite my family being really religious, it has also…Continue

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Comment by Darrel Ray on October 19, 2009 at 8:21am
Julia, I think Richard is on target with his comment. The key, as I say in my book, is to respond to the human not the virus inside the person. You cannot argue with a virus. The more you try, the more frustrating it is for both of you. If she had a cold, you would not argue with her about feeling bad or feeling sick. As Richard says, focus on her humanity. If she cannot relate without her virus, then there may not be a basis for a relationship. In some ways it is like alcoholism. The alcoholic has a relationship with the bottle first, humans second. Religious people have a relationship with their virus, and secondarily to other humans. Their filters are so strong that they literally cannot relate to people except through the virus.
Comment by Richard Goscicki on October 19, 2009 at 12:33am
That's easy, Julia. Just focus on your common interest and leave religion alone. Your friend sounds irremediable. If she’s been on her knees praying to God her whole life, it doesn’t look like she’ll stand up now. You just can’t give her a vaccine when you’re dealing with the God virus.
Comment by Darrel Ray on October 10, 2009 at 11:23pm
Just spoke in Portland this week about my book and 7 people stayed after to talk about getting an RR group started. Hope we can see on or two in the area soon. If you know anyone in the Portland area who might be interested, let them know.
Comment by Jerry Howell on October 8, 2009 at 9:01am
Marshall, thanks for the link. I downloaded ASH1, 2, and 3 and listen to them yesterday. I like your format hope you keep it up.
Comment by Marshall on October 4, 2009 at 1:05pm
For those of you who haven't heard our interview with RR's founder (Darrel), check out the group for The Agnostic Salvation Hour and listen to epidsode ASH2.
Comment by Darrel Ray on October 4, 2009 at 10:54am
Off to Portland this week to speak at Reed College about The God Virus. If you know of anyone in the Portland area, let them know. Here is a link to the Reed College event. You will notice that Richared Dawkins is trying to upstage me by coming to Portland State on Oct. 10. I think I'll let him slide this time. I will also be letting people know about RR and hoping to get some interest and getting some groups started in the Portland area.
Comment by Richard Goscicki on September 11, 2009 at 8:02am
Mariana, If you're taking a philosophy course perhaps we could exchange ideas about individual philosophers. I'm starting a course in November with my Humanist group.

But look out. I've always appreciated the line by Theodosius Dobzhansky, the 1920s paleoentologist and member of the evolution synthesis.

"Any book written before 1859 (the year of Origin of Species) is essentially worthless."

It's like a reading a book by a geologist who believes the world is flat. Dobzhansky exempted David Hume from the statement.
Comment by Richard Goscicki on September 7, 2009 at 6:16pm
I forgot the Youtube link for the Dawkins/Lennox debate. Very information and educational. You hear both sides. There's about 12 videos, above is the promo.
Comment by Richard Goscicki on September 7, 2009 at 5:54pm
Mariana, let’s switch to the “It’s a Race” discussion above. We’re getting off the track of Recovering from Religion. Just a thought, depending on how you and Darrell feel. I don’t’ know if our conversation is what he had in mind.

Let me tell you, I feel like I’m reading Anne Frank in your posts for some strange reason. You are about the same age as she when she wrote her diary and you have a similar precocity and objectivity.

and that there are lots of religious scientists who manage to amalgamate their belief in God with evolution.

This actually happened to me when I was teaching bio. The other biology teacher was as pious and orthodox as can be. My attitude was, “how the hell can you study biology and not believe in evolution. The teach bio is to tell the story of evolution.” He somehow “amalgamated” the two ideas and got away with it. I don’t even think he even thought about it.

Actually, I did some research on this, years ago. Pope John Pope II wrote a papal bull stating that evolution is okay with Catholics as long as they concede that God intervened. Remember the Sistine Chapel painting where God holds out his finger and “inspires” Adam who is holding out his finger as they nearly touch. The idea is, man- (and woman-) kind evolved from lower life forms but along the way God infused a soul, and the early hominid became Homo sapiens. (What a misnomer. In my book Mirror Reversal, mankind is Homo vacuous.)

To me, what a cope out. Why doesn’t the Bible say anything about this? Talk about biblical prophesies, why the heck doesn’t the good book make any predictions with some teeth—like the JFK assassination or the Protestant Reformation. All we get are vague statements that future bible writers can fill in after the fact.

As a side note, I share the opinion that scientists should no longer publicly debate creationists-- it only reinforces the idea that it's a viable alternative to real science.
I think they should debate, how else are we going to change things. Here’s a great debate between Dr. Dawkins and a hard-headed Irishman (aren’t they all?), John Lennox, who holds that Christ is the answer. We can discuss it, if you’re into philosophy.
Comment by Richard Goscicki on September 6, 2009 at 12:15am
"I cannot believe someone as intelligent as yourself doesn't believe in God."

Mariana, your father messed up the line above. Actually, Ayn Rand said this to the archconservative, William F. Buckley, “You are far too intelligent to believe in Gutt.” (She had a bit of a Russian accent.)


The Blind Watchmaker and Climbing Mount Improbable both try to explain to believers (non-believers of Darwin) how so much complexity as modern animals and plants can evolve given ages of time. The Azoic Age was 500 million years. That’s the period of time with no life at all on the planet. A lot can happen in a half billion years. JWs can’t seem to understand the power of time and the evolutionary algorhythm. Simply put, it’s variation of a googol of gametes, (eggs and sperm), which are selected naturally, and then somehow retained. Even Darwin never fully understood the retention process, (he called them factors) but the Evolutionary Synthesis of the ‘20s confirmed Darwinism with the onset of the new science of genetics. Picture this little program running over and over for four billion years. Variation, Selection, Retention.

A JW kid knocked on my door last year and he was very interested in evolution. We wound up having several conversations over the next few months and I think I might have opened some doors in this thinking. I haven’t seen him in a year, but I think I might have saved his life.

He fed me the whole "atheists are dogmatic" shtick and even used the word "Darwinist."

The above is very wrong. The word “dogmatic” means referring to dogma or doctrines. Tell your friend atheists don’t have any doctrines. We just don’t believe what clergypersons are telling us. It’s the churches that have all the infallible doctrines.

I read a post on Pharyngula recently about ignorance being considered a virtue by some people

This statement speaks for itself and doesn’t need any comment. Fear of knowledge is a sad thing. To me it’s closing the door on life and trying to be safe and content in a mental cage.

Mariana, I would suggest not getting into discussions or arguments with doctrinaire people. You’re a very bright girl, so use your brain to make yourself independent through education. Once you’re able to live your own and take care of yourself, you’ll see how friends and family will have much more respect for what you say and who you are.

As the old Yiddish singer named Fanny Brice (Funny Girl) liked to say: you gotta use all the brains ya got.
 

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