Recovering from Religion

Comment

Comment by joeyess on June 15, 2010 at 10:45pm

nice to meet you , by the way, Shelby. What do you do for a living?

Comment by Shelby Fisher on June 15, 2010 at 10:44pm

Nice, I wish we could too.

Peace

Comment by joeyess on June 15, 2010 at 9:23pm

Agreed. Live and let live, and to quote the bible (gasp!) I am my brother's keeper.

I wish we could all follow this simple creed.

And yes, we as a species will never completely leave silly superstitions behind, but this monkey-in-shoes certainly has.

;^)

Comment by Shelby Fisher on June 15, 2010 at 8:45pm

Thanks, Joeyess.
I would prefer the superstitions be left behind as well. My way of thinking is that seeing as this is not logically likely when we observe the constant beliefs by those who can not produce a shred of evidence supporting their beliefs, it is better for me to look for positives in an otherwise ignorant, frustrating system of logic where proof is claimed by the statement "because I know". It is funny, no doubt. For me, I find comfort in any connection between myself and others, and in the possibility that even the misguided can contribute to our world in a loving way. Of course, I do not support extremists and am disgusted by their exploitation of those who are seemingly unable to think logically for themselves so are influenced through fear and rhetoric.
I in no way condone the malicious acts of any group and am saddened by their being strengthened and encouraged to continue by numbers.
I respect your views one-hundred percent. I just find it helpful in my life to find the good as best I can, and in the face of absurd claims and morals stemming from nonsense I find that for me it is best to investigate into the positives that are produced by them. Otherwise, I grow angry and frustrated which only leads to my negative impact on others and on myself. And yes, I sometimes find it helpful to point and laugh.

Comment by joeyess on June 15, 2010 at 8:18pm

Thanks again, however I take exception to your statement that:

If what it takes for someone to find peace is for them to believe in a god or a unicorn or the goblin responsible for stealing their socks, I am just happy for them when it enables them to spread seeds of compassion and love and not partake in holy wars and ostracizing those who know these beings to be nothing at all but silly wishes.

I would prefer we leave silly superstitions behind, even benign ones. Because even the benign enables the extremist to exist. Indeed, I believe, that even the benevolent forms of belief enable the extremists to wrap themselves in a cloak of sacrosanctity. So, I'm in no way, shape or form very tolerant any longer towards believers because they do nothing to reel in their wing-nuts.

The one headline you will never read?

Fundamental-Atheist Group Blows Up Airliner. 300 Dead. Richard Dawkins Claims Responsibility.

So, no. I just don't think I'll give them quarter. I'll point and laugh or just quietly shake my head and walk away. Depending on their level of Teh Stoopid and my threshold for toleration of Teh Stoopid at that particular time.

Comment by Shelby Fisher on June 15, 2010 at 7:42pm

Well said, Joeyess. The cultivation of love and compassion are, I believe, our greatest challenge in the face of the our absurd world. It enables our action to spread, as you say, the seeds. The universe's indifference can be upsetting and liberating. Memory is a wonderful, terrible thing. Memory continues and I prefer it to be pleasant as often as possible. I find what helps me when conversing with a theist is to understand (when applicable) that the person is doing what they believe spreads this seed. While misleading, it many times is not a negative action and many people find comfort through it. We all have different requirements for comfort and I feel comforted when I see someone who has found some. We exist in the infinity of space and there are no rules regarding conduct. If what it takes for someone to find peace is for them to believe in a god or a unicorn or the goblin responsible for stealing their socks, I am just happy for them when it enables them to spread seeds of compassion and love and not partake in holy wars and ostracizing those who know these beings to be nothing at all but silly wishes. Sometimes, the end justifies the means.

Comment by joeyess on June 15, 2010 at 4:20pm

Thank you, Richard. My journey to non-belief began 30 years ago. It's been a long, strange transition but I've found life and, yes, death much easier to deal with. No one suddenly becomes an atheist. Especially if you were bathed in "the blood" growing up. It's a long hard slog out of the dark realm of superstition to the warm light of reason. I'm still on the journey and the sun shines a little brighter every day.

Comment by Richard Goscicki on June 15, 2010 at 4:06pm

Joeyess, neat post. I certainly agree. Our only afterlife is in the memories of others. That's why I wrote Mirror Reversal—an attempt to have my thoughts live on.

If everybody tried to make the world a better place—as you say, cleaner, kinder, gentler—if soon would be.

Comment by joeyess on June 15, 2010 at 2:00pm

I only believe in the observable. I'm not a scientist, but I gotta see it to believe it. Our physical existence is the only real bite of the apple we get. That existence includes love, pain, grief, joy, laughter, unfortunate suffering, and loss. But it is the only trip we get to take thru this magnificent, serendipitous universe, and in the grand scheme of things, we're here for less time than the blink of an eye, then we're gone. And the universe won't even notice our absence. Only the ones we love and those who love us matter. We need to cultivate that love as much as possible and spread it like dandelion seeds. Setting those seeds upon the wind is up to us. And if it allows us to leave our little corner of our world better and cleaner, kinder and gentler than we found it, we've succeeded in our lives. No easy task and no higher truth that I know of.

j.

Comment by Shelby Fisher on June 15, 2010 at 1:43pm

Absolutely. I am pro-laughter... It's funny how a concept can become so ingrained in one's mind that even after dismissing it, it remains a part of life without any known existence. I find concerning myself with the physical world to be the most beneficial to furthering my understanding of anything, people, thoughts, emotions, etc. You?

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