Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Allan on September 18, 2012 at 4:51pm

 I just wrote the great author Sam Harris about this subject. That "void," that Mr. Harris speaks of is very real to someone of faith. Below is a small portion of the story that I sent to Mr. Harris. My nephew was only 21 years old when he took his own life.  Here are the txt messages sent to him, from me, a week before his passing.

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August 20 4:27pm

Me: Do you study debate/psychology or have speech classes.

CJ: I'm gonna have a psych class in the next semester

Me: Ok cool. If you wanna get a heads up on the competition do you know who Sam Harris is? (Meaning it would be a great debate subject)

CJ: No i don't

Me: This guy is fearless. I enjoy debate watch it all the time. This guy is the best speaker I've ever heard.

CJ: Ill look him up

Me: Watch: "Sam Harris simply destroys Catholicism while in debate at Notre Dame" (YouTube)

Me: I've read the moral Landscape its good but the end of faith is supposedly his best work

My fiancee woke me up, screaming about the tragedy, and my first thought was the debate video.

Did depression,inevitably, kill CJ? Will the autopsy find a tumor on his brain? Was he murdered? Or the question I ponder the most in my mind...Did the video I sent him (Sam Harris Simply destroys  Catholicism in a Notre Dame Debate) taken in the wrong context, plus depression, make him feel that void (you speak of) was too much to handle? Did this void make him think it was acceptable to commit the selfish act of taking ones own life?

Mr. Harris, that void you write about is very real. I can attest. I often ponder all the time wasted in my life with the absurd Catholic religion that I participated in as a child and young adult. Its easier for me to deal with it because I'm used to being an outcast (politically)  for being transparent and honest.

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The original letter is much longer and goes into more detail about my nephew and myself.  I really enjoy debate and look forward to any type of meetings to polish these skills.  If anyone reading this lives in Northwest Indiana can help with any social gatherings for Atheists that would surely help.  

Permalink Reply by Ruth Anthony-Gardner on September 18, 2012 at 5:25pm

Interesting article, thanks. Glad I live in an urban area.

Permalink Reply by Ant Mac on September 26, 2012 at 4:48pm

Well, being a polite rooster bye and large, I will be gentle with my thoughts as to why Religious-Americans fear Atheist-Americans, not wanting to offend anyone. =]

 

I feel it is because right from the first European invasion of the American shores, people have been telling themselves (religious) stories that excuse their behaviour there. It is just human nature after all.

 

"Bringing the Civilising Word of God to the Benighted Savages" was one of the very first stories, and the moral blemish of actually being a ursurping, nation destroying, rapacious pack of pirates to the Native-Americans was washed out of the French, English and Spanish  soul by sticking hard to the story.

Later, with the slavery thing, it was justified again by the same "But we lifted them out of Benighted Savagery in Africa, of course they are better off here in a Christian land, as slaves".

Also the "We Escaped from Religious Persecution to practice Our Faith in Peace and Equality" story was told, as a pleasant mental wash to dissolve all the instances of Religious Persecution the "Pilgrim Fathers" indulged themselves in.

 

To this day the Religous-Americans have preferred the story to facing the past straight on. And if they have to give a place to people who refuse to believe the story, look at all the crimes they will have to acknowledge as their heritage. Just mho of course.

Permalink Reply by Scott McGreal on October 5, 2012 at 9:42pm

I have read some sociological studies that have found that greater economic equality and security is associated with decreased religious belief. Studies cite the examples of countries like Sweden and Denmark which have comprehensive welfare systems and quite low levels of religious belief. The USA on the other hand has great economic disparities and is quite unusual for a developed country in having high levels of religious belief. The poorest and most politically unstable countries in the world, e.g. those in sub-Saharan Africa, also have the highest levels of religious belief with over 95% of people professing belief in god. Researchers have proposed that religion provides people with a sense of security when they are uncertain about being able to meet their basic needs. In countries like Sweden and Denmark, people feel very assured of meeting their needs so religion loses its appeal. I wonder if this has something to do with fear of Atheism in the USA. People feel more insecure so they become more intolerant of people who do not share (and implicitly undermine) their belief that god will take care of them. That is, when atheists express their view that god is not real, religious people become troubled by doubts that atheists might be right, and they don't like it. 

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