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No Nonsense

Anti-pseudoscience, anti-woo, pro science, pro critical thinking, no conspiracy theories, no spin. Count the logical fallacies. No Nonsense!

Members: 350
Latest Activity: yesterday

"Keep an open mind – but not so open that your brain falls out" -unknown

"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan

"What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence." -- Christopher Hitchens

What is a logical fallacy? All arguments have the same basic structure: A therefore B. They begin with one or more premises (A), which is a fact or assumption upon which the argument is based. They then apply a logical principle (therefore) to arrive at a conclusion (B). An example of a logical principle is that of equivalence. For example, if you begin with the premises that A=B and B=C, you can apply the logical principle of equivalence to conclude that A=C. A logical fallacy is a false or incorrect logical principle. An argument that is based upon a logical fallacy is therefore not valid. It is important to note that if the logic of an argument is valid then the conclusion must also be valid, which means that if the premises are all true then the conclusion must also be true. Valid logic applied to one or more false premises, however, leads to an invalid argument. Also, if an argument is not valid the conclusion may, by chance, still be true. For a more thorough discussion of logical fallacies and how to structure a logical argument, see the New England Skeptical Society's article, How To Argue.

Top 20 Logical Fallacies (in alphabetical order) taken from -

The Skeptics' Guide To The Universe

The New England Skeptical Society The Skeptics' Guide To The Universe Science-Based Medicine
The James Randi Educational Foundation
Propaganda
snopes.com
Bad Science by Ben Goldacre
Simon Singh and his fight to mend British libel laws
Professor Richard Wiseman
PZ Myers' Pharyngula
Dr. Phil Plait and Bad Astronomy
Skeptic Blog
Michael Shermer's Baloney Detection Kit
The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark by Carl Sagan
The Skeptics' Dictionary
List of cognitive biases
Don Watson - Weasel Words
QuackWatch
A List of Fallacious Arguments

Chat #NoNonsense

"No skeptic, to my knowledge, ever made a major scientific discovery or advanced the welfare of others."

-- Deepak Chopra (yes, he actually said that)

"The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds the most discoveries, is not "Eureka!" (I found it!) but That's funny..." -Isaac Asimov



The scientific world view is full of awe and wonder. Understanding how truly awesome the universe is – in its elegant complexity, its staggering beauty, and the many intricate systems of which it is comprised – gives a profound feeling of connectedness and sparks the imagination. And it has the advantage of being real. -Steven Novella



The glory which is built upon a lie soon becomes a most unpleasant incumbrance. How easy it is to make people believe a lie, and how hard it is to undo that work again.
— Mark Twain

Discussion Forum

Hell for christians? Hell for all?

Started by Patricia. Last reply by Bertold Brautigan on Tuesday. 56 Replies

Why Name Calling

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner Oct 30. 0 Replies

Psychic Power-NOT

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Michael Penn Oct 14. 7 Replies

Gish Gallop

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Tom Sarbeck Aug 18. 4 Replies

What counts as proof for existential threats

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Tom Sarbeck Jun 14. 1 Reply

Cheating with Science

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Michael Penn May 22. 6 Replies

Apocalypse anxiety

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Luara May 9. 7 Replies

Young adults belief in demon posession

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Ruth Anthony-Gardner May 8. 12 Replies

Challenging lies doesn't work

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Michael Penn May 7. 2 Replies

Mere question elicits false memories

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Michael Penn May 7. 1 Reply

Political discourse in US - fundamentally fallacious

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Tom Sarbeck May 5. 13 Replies

F*ck You= Australia's Coal Policy

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Loren Miller Apr 17. 4 Replies

Name truthiness

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Joan Denoo Mar 1. 1 Reply

Frustration at RealClimate

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Grinning Cat Dec 1, 2013. 2 Replies

Religion correlates with Climate Denial

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner Nov 27, 2013. 0 Replies

Liberal Washing

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Joan Denoo Nov 2, 2013. 1 Reply

Information Technology amplifies irrational group behavior

Started by Ruth Anthony-Gardner. Last reply by Joan Denoo Apr 13, 2013. 3 Replies

Comment Wall

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Comment by James M. Martin on October 19, 2014 at 8:22am
Just a quick note to say that this is just possibly the most important group at A|N. Why? Because it is so nuts and bolts. The only way to attack dogma is to point out the fallacies in what passes for logic in the religionist message. My all time fave is post hoc reasoning. All religions lay claim to the "miraculous." If we could teach CHILDREN this one fallacy -- e.g. that God put the rainbow in the sky to say there would be no more world-wide destruction such as Noah's flood, the fact that we've only had a few tsunamis means God exists because, obviously, he has kept his word. Rainbows don't prove God. We can laugh at the Rev. John Hagees calling Katrina a punishment by God of the wicked city of New Orleans (God doesn't eat shellfish, you know, or doesn't want you to) preaching that after this, because of this is a silly invention of the evolutionists. But the great unwashed actually believe these silly things. They actually think that Jesus had a miraculous power of healing, not that when Reb Yeshua passed by he was able to cure Lazarus of his E.D. with some plant form of Cialis (more than likely his queer lips).
Comment by Ruth Anthony-Gardner on October 19, 2014 at 1:11am

Comment by Joan Denoo on October 18, 2014 at 11:05pm

"Remember the past, live in the present and remember your preferred future." 

My mentor, author of  Thinking in the Future Tense by Edward B. Lindaman (May 1978), president of Whitworth College 1970 - 1980. Previously he was with North American Rockwell, as director of programming for the Apollo space project.

Comment by Grinning Cat on October 18, 2014 at 10:41pm

Seen going around the net:

Ayn Rand, Rand Paul and Paul Ryan walk into a bar. The bartender serves them tainted alcohol because there are no regulations. They die.

(image source)

Comment by Joseph P on October 18, 2014 at 9:21pm

When did I say he's a Muslim?  If I had as many assholes accusing me of being a Muslim, as he has, I'd be admitting it vocally, after my second election, just to fuck with them.

Comment by Tom Sarbeck on October 18, 2014 at 9:14pm

I look forward to the good old days when it was never brought up.

Forward to the past?

Whichever way you go to get there, it was never brought up because we didn't exist.

Except in the 1800 Adam/Jefferson contest. J was called "atheistical" and fearmongerers said blood will run in the streets.

Comment by Joan Denoo on October 18, 2014 at 9:09pm

Joseph, I don't think he is a Muslim or a Christian. I do think he is a Chicago School of Economics fundamentalist. Just look at his cabinet appointments. 

Comment by James M. Martin on October 18, 2014 at 8:36pm

Uh, maybe he isn't a Muslim.

Comment by Joseph P on October 18, 2014 at 8:20pm

What I don't get is why Obama doesn't finally admit that he's a Muslim.  It isn't like he has to win another election.

Comment by James M. Martin on October 18, 2014 at 8:41am

Tom, the problem is, their God-infection spreads to non-conservative pols as well. They lambasted Obama so often and so long on grounds he was not a Christian but a Muslim, he eventually had to make much ado of it himself, "I am a Christian," accompanied by the usual photos of him going to church and so forth. They should not even be suffered to mention religion in the same breath as politics, and the majority on the SCOTUS similarly indulge the far right religious nuts. Even Bernie Sanders is forced to tell the Pew people his faith is "Judaism," but thankfully we are in on the joke: a vast number of those so-identified are secular Jews. (Their mom was Jewish, but they do not practice.) I have to doubt Bernie is a practicing Jew, but I may be wrong. Problem is, you must pass the litmus test to be considered presidential material. My point, and I know I am preaching to the choir, is that religious beliefs should not even be part of the discussion. I look forward to the good old days when it was never brought up.

 

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