Comment

Comment by Jonathan Simeone on May 8, 2012 at 10:40pm

I wonder if the outrage we might expect from the African-American community isn’t present here because Champion was gay. A good number of African-Americans are very much conservative Christians. In California Proposition 8 was successful, in part, because a huge number of African-Americans who had never voted before went to the polls to vote for Obama. Overwhelmingly they supported the discriminatory measure.

 

At the time that didn’t make any sense to me. As a person who has been discriminated against I had a hard time understanding how so many people who must have experienced discrimination in their own lives could be so supportive of such a discriminatory proposal.

Comment by Joan Denoo on May 8, 2012 at 9:50pm

I don't own a TV and don't read or listen to commercial news so I am really out of touch with the usual news threads. I find sites this one gives me more information, I appreciate you posting the articles about gays, Sentient. I just feel so enraged that this stuff goes on. 

Comment by Sentient Biped on May 8, 2012 at 9:44pm

Joan what almost makes me more upset than the brutal killing is there no outrage and little interest almost anywhere.  The main places where I have read about this is, blogs by black gay bloggers.  It's like someone has to be both in order for it to matter.  It's really upsetting.

Comment by Joan Denoo on May 8, 2012 at 9:39pm

"Witnesses in the Champion case have told his parents he might have been targeted because he opposed the culture of hazing they say has long existed in the band. It has also been suggested to them that he was targeted because Champion was gay and a candidate for chief drum major.

Why? Whatever possessed them to kill this man, why? Is there no sense of morals or ethics in those killers? What is their value base? Who do they turn to for guidance? What entitles them to be judge, jury and executioner? Is there so much hate out there that these killings will continue. Who are the hate mongers? What are they saying, writing, broadcasting? Is our country better for their hate mongering?

Who is accountable in perpetrating these crimes against fellow human beings? 

Comment by Sentient Biped on May 8, 2012 at 9:30am

Loren, I think you are right.  This having happened in Florida, I don't trust that it will be pursued without national outrage.  I also don't think there will be national outrage about a group of students (a mob?) murdering a young gay black man.  Shameful. 

Comment by Loren Miller on May 4, 2012 at 6:12pm

Check me on this, but I'd swear that civil rights violations carry severer penalties than the relative slap on the wrist being proposed in the case of the Florida A&M drum-major's case.

Comment by Sentient Biped on May 4, 2012 at 9:09am

Back on the hazing death, i read on one lawyer's blog that if someone is killed by a group, the individuals of that group actually can be guilty of murder. I don't know if that is true.  I know I've seen murder mysteries with murder-by-committee, but those are fiction.  Most likely the members of the group did not intend to kill, just beat, humiliate, isolate, degrade, inflict pain, and frighten. "Just" before those words seems obscene.  They could face up to 5 years in prison for felony hazing, which is not trivial but not the same as a murder charge.  No human rights violations?  Regardless of that, where is the outrage?  Trayvon -> outrage.  Tyler Clementi-> outrage.  Robert Champion -> how many people know about it?  I suspect there is a confluence of race / gay that leaves both communities not as concerned about him.  Sorry to say that.   This is not just hazing - there have been hazings resulting in death, not a lot, but some.  This young man was beat to death on a bus by 13 fellow students.

Comment by Jonathan Simeone on May 4, 2012 at 8:23am

That's not correct. There have been many crimes where someone has knowingly used a car as a weapon. When someone chooses to drink way more than they should and then chooses to get behind the wheel they are, in my view, just about as guilty as someone who chooses to smash their car into someone without having consumed large amounts of alcohol first. That's especially true when they have driven drunk many times previously. How is it justice when someone drives drunk, kills someone and spends less than two years in prison?  

Comment by Susan Stanko on May 4, 2012 at 8:11am

NobodyCHOOSES to smash into cars.

Comment by Jonathan Simeone on May 4, 2012 at 7:17am

In my opinion, we make it too easy for those whose actions lead to death. How is it not murder when a group of people beat on someone else until they suffer life-ending injuries? How is it not murder when you choose to get intoxicated? Then you choose to drive and smash into someone else’s car? In my view, murder should be when you take someone else’s life. We need a serious roll back on the number of mitigating circumstances are laws currently allow for when actions cause death. It’s another example of our culture of irresponsibility.  

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