Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Patricia on March 18, 2013 at 5:41pm

Good lecture Joan! We'd all do well to pay attention methinks.

Permalink Reply by Steph S. on March 18, 2013 at 8:42pm

Good - I hope men join up.

Permalink Reply by Grinning Cat on March 18, 2013 at 10:36pm

Usually when I see a video I think "I'll watch it later" (maybe). I'm glad I took the time to listen! Thank you, Joan!

Tony Porter told some powerful stories from his own life, how the restrictive "man box" he'd been socialized into did real damage when he was a father of preschoolers, and previously when he was a boy.

It is good to see so many men in Hang With Friends who clearly view women as people, as equals; who express a full range of emotions; who are simply free to be whole persons.

Permalink Reply by Grinning Cat on March 18, 2013 at 10:45pm

The aspects of the "man box" are both symptoms and perpetuators of Dominator Culture. (Joan, thanks for attaching a graphic!) I'll repeat the list as text, to make sure it's google-able:

  

THE MAN BOX

Do not cry openly or express emotions
with the exception of anger

Do not express weakness or fear

Demonstrate power/control
especially over women

Aggression - Dominance

Protector

Do not be "like a woman"

Heterosexual

Do not be "like a gay man"

Tough/Athletic/Strength/Courage

Makes Decisions - does not need help

Views women as property/objects
[especially sexual objects]

 

Permalink Reply by Joan Denoo on March 18, 2013 at 10:53pm

Grinning Cat , thank you for post the "Man Box". For some reason, my Reply does not include a menu and so I post photos as Attachments.

Permalink Reply by Grinning Cat on March 18, 2013 at 10:59pm

Mr. Porter also mentioned how, as a 12-year-old, he and his friends felt the pressure that "real men" should be having as much sex as possible.

That brought to mind Al Vernacchio's model of sexuality; he explains that the common baseball metaphor -- first base, second base, "scoring", etc. -- is restrictive and debasing, and has many things wrong with it. A better model is... pizza! Most of us enjoy pizza, whether once in a while or every day; we have different appetites and tastes; when we have pizza with other people we talk about what toppings we both/all enjoy; and nobody criticizes us for passing up pizza when we're not actually hungry, or in the mood for different food.

"To Slide or to Slice? Finding a Positive Sexual Metaphor"
http://www.scarleteen.com/article/sexuality/to_slide_or_to_slice_fi...

Permalink Reply by Ruth Anthony-Gardner on March 18, 2013 at 11:25pm

The Man Box is articulate and insightful. I wish every man could take this seriously.

Permalink Reply by Joan Denoo on March 20, 2013 at 1:18am

Grinning Cat, I am so pleased you are familiar with "Dominator Culture". When I read Eisler's book, the "Chalice and the Blade" I knew she was on to something. She led me to Marija Gimbutas, an archeologist who did much of her work in Old Europe and her editor, Joan Marler. One thing led to another and I jointed them on a trip to Turkey, Greece and Crete searching for temples of the goddesses. It was an experience of a lifetime and formed the scaffolding upon which I built my philosophy.

Permalink Reply by Grinning Cat on April 15, 2013 at 12:36pm

Ruth just created a new group on here, "Partnership Vision", precisely about Riane Eisler's ideas on Dominator Culture and Partnership Culture, and how they intersect with our tendencies towards violence.

Permalink Reply by Grinning Cat on March 28, 2013 at 9:06pm

Derrick Jensen writes that the man box is about the cult-of-masculinity aggressors vs. everybody else: "about putting everyone else in a box, the box of other, of less than, of trophies, the box of the violable, the box of targets, the box of victims, the box of the violated, the box of proof of the men’s own manhood."

(Dominator Culture, indeed!!)

Permalink Reply by Joan Denoo on March 28, 2013 at 9:21pm

My mother and both grandmothers were trying to say the same thing as this man and they were not heard. At last! Men begin to understand and they are led by the fine men in our AN community. A hat tip to our fine brothers in building healthier communities.

Permalink Reply by Grinning Cat on March 29, 2013 at 10:19am

Now on Urban Dictionary: "man box", "Dominator Culture", "Partnership Culture"

(Yes, UD has a high noise-to-signal ratio, but this might help make those terms a bit more visible on the internet.)

Please vote "thumbs up" on these definitions if you agree with them. Thanks!

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