Godless in the garden


Godless in the garden

Welcome to gardeners, growers of veggies, fruits, flowers, and trees!  


Welcome  backyard hen enthusiasts, worm farmers, beekeepers & composters!

Location: Planet Earth
Members: 174
Latest Activity: 8 hours ago

Welcome to Eden!

If you like to dig in the dirt, plant & prune, grow food & flowers, or sit and watch as someone else does your landscaping, you'll find something here to discuss!

Selected topics, in sort of alphabetical order:
Aging.  Gardening with an older body.
bees.  insectary.  insectsbee gardening. Beneficial insects.  insects drive evolution

Compost.  herecontaminated compost.

Backyard Chickens here. here. here. here.

Edible yard.  here  urban farmfront yards.
Growing Fruits


Fragrance and Scenthere.
Fruit growing.  in a small space, by backyard orchard culture.
Frugal gardening.  labels.

Gardening for future generations.  also permaculture, trees, historic varieties, soil

Hegelkultur here, here, here

Heritage and historic varieties.   heresources

locally grown plants to prevent blight transmission here.

Moon Phase Widget here. Moon phase topic here.

PeppersHot peppers.

Permaculture MollisonFalk  Liu, Joan's IntroTransformation in 90 days, Perm Principles at work. Food forest, Holzer

Potatoes.  here.

Rooftop gardening.  here

Seed starting. starting spring crops.

Scientific Gardening.   The Informed Gardener.  The truth about garden remedies.

Soil and soil building - healthy soil microbes, mycelium, dirt is everything, soil analysissoil pH.


Tomatoes.  Myths and truths

Trees.  Tree tunnels.  Ancient tree planting. Plant commemorative trees

Discussion Forum

Fruit Pests: Apricot

Started by Joan Denoo. Last reply by Joan Denoo yesterday. 3 Replies

Permaculture, Ben Falk

Started by Joan Denoo. Last reply by Joan Denoo on Thursday. 1 Reply

Change, the only constant

Started by Joan Denoo. Last reply by Joan Denoo Jun 16. 4 Replies

Change, the only constant

Started by Joan Denoo Jun 15. 0 Replies

Favorite Flowers

Started by Daniel W. Last reply by Randall Smith Jun 8. 8 Replies

The Evolution of Ecological Consciousness

Started by Joan Denoo. Last reply by Joan Denoo Jun 4. 1 Reply

Living in the forest

Started by Joan Denoo. Last reply by Idaho Spud May 27. 6 Replies

Good plants that volunteer.

Started by Daniel W. Last reply by Idaho Spud May 25. 17 Replies


Started by Joan Denoo. Last reply by Daniel W May 2. 2 Replies


Started by Joan Denoo. Last reply by Idaho Spud May 2. 1 Reply

Sentient Biped's Garden Blog. Happy to add a different feed if there are suggestions.

Comment Wall


You need to be a member of Godless in the garden to add comments!

Comment by Chad Kreutzer on September 17, 2013 at 2:43pm

Finally a reasoned non "monsantodidit" explanation.

Comment by Joan Denoo on September 17, 2013 at 1:48pm
Comment by Daniel W on September 17, 2013 at 10:39am

Last night I stopped at Fred Meyer for groceries, after work.  They had bulbs out for fall planting.  I bought several varieties of narcissus - supposedly deer and rabbit resistant.  Mostly the smaller types so they don't fall over easily.  I want to plant them around the edges of some of the raised beds, and in the mulch circles around some trees. 

Narcissus "Minnow"

I love planting the fall bulbs.

Narcissus "Jetfire"

Also a bearded iris rhizome.  I don't know why I bought that - it's a variety I already have.  I just love planting the dried out looking things and watching them settle in and rejuvenate and grow.  The variety is a near-black midnight-blue called "Before the Storm". 

The pics are from web searches.

Comment by Joan Denoo on September 15, 2013 at 1:24pm

Chris, I feel as strongly as you and I suspect many women who came into the world with harsh or superstitious beliefs found it impossible to thrive in such environments and we had to build our strengths and knowledge to be able to reject such nonsense. 

I count myself as one of the lucky ones who escaped, finding my mind too precious to waste on values that dehumanize. 

I love your comment!

Comment by Joan Denoo on September 15, 2013 at 1:19pm

Daniel, your photo of your boxed garden is gorgeous! A joy to behold! I just get goose bumps when I think of you in your garden and enjoying the pleasure of growing things. Glad your partner has an appetite for good flavors. 

Love your story of the butchers and meat eaters in your family and you being "a mix up at the hospital". 

I sent your use of mole hills for access to more minerals for your box beds to my son-in-law, Larry, who is starting to garden this year. He is new to it and plans to use fish tanks as a source of water for the boxes he built this summer. He likes to experiment and we have great fun thinking up ways to engineer the whole process. He has mole hills that drive him crazy and maybe reading your account of their value, he may be able to reframe his experience into opportunity. 

I am surprised honey bees don't go to the Buddleias. Even though they can look scraggly, I love the blossoms. Mine died out, probably from hard freezes. 

I agree, not only should religion be challenged, it needs to be charged with crimes against children and adults and have Warning Notices " put on the doors, and tattooed onto foreheads of believers. Well, that may be a bit much.  

Comment by Joan Denoo on September 15, 2013 at 12:35pm

Daniel, you probably have done the same search as I, and here is what I found:

Grow Your Best Fall Garden Vegetables: What, When and How

" In colder climates it’s prime time to sow carrots, rutabagas, and turnips to harvest in the fall. Filling space vacated by spring crops with summer-sown vegetables will keep your garden productive well into fall, and even winter."

~ published August/September 2009


"Turnips are easy to grow if sown in the proper season. They mature in two months and may be planted either in the spring, late summer or fall for roots or greens. The spring crop is planted for early summer use. The fall crop, which is usually larger and of higher quality, is often stored for winter use."

Also includes varieties list

Urban Programs Resource Network

Comment by Daniel W on September 15, 2013 at 8:59am

Late winter / early spring I was over-enthusiastic about planting Buddleias -I thought they would be good forage for honeybees. The honeybees ignore them. And they need dead-heading to look less messy.  But bubblebees are enthusiastic. These are a non-invasive variety, but they grew fast.  So I think I'll leave them in place.

Comment by Daniel W on September 15, 2013 at 8:35am

Chris, your reaction to the religious environment is much like mine.  I know I'm illegal in the religious world.  It's religion that should be illegal.

Joan, my paternal great-grandfather was a butcher, and my mother's dad raised animals for slaughter.  My dad hunted animals.  And I am vegetarian.  But they sometimes said they wondered if I was a mix up in the hospital. 

Yesterday I cleaned up a vegetable raised bed.  My partner wants to grow cabbages and turnips.  It might be too late.  I am thinking about a cover for the bed, so it works like a cold frame.  I added a wheelbarrow of compost and topped it with a fine soil-compost mix.

Then I completed construction and filling of another raised bed.  This one will be multiplier onions.  The soil mix is about 1/3 to 1/2 compost from the yard debris composting center.  The bulk topsoil is collected from mole hill.  Two acres has a lot of mole hills.  I collect them with a flat shovel, getting a wheelbarrow load every couple of weeks.  The soil is finely ground, no stones, no weeds, few weed seeds, light, mixes easily.  Since they tunnel deeply, the soil should contain minerals that wash deeply due to NW rains.  This ameliorates my annoyance at the little kritters.

Comment by Plinius on September 15, 2013 at 12:51am

I have a theory that people, even several generations removed from active religious practices, continue to act according the religious teachings.


Perhaps men do so, but as a woman growing up in religious surroundings, I've always felt illegal, like an unwanted stranger. That is what you get from the womanhaters the bible and the church are filled with. But, being unwanted, it was easier for me to leave and it left me free to make my own rules.


Comment by Joan Denoo on September 14, 2013 at 3:43pm

Spud, my family were "meat and potatoes" people too. My father and grandfather owned their own slaughter houses and butcher shops in small rural towns in Whitman County, WA state. We ate everything from pigs ears to beef tails, even pickled pigs feet. They made their own sausages, and I remember helping Dad fill casings with sausage and twisting between each wiener or sausage. My grandmothers raised, killed and cooked chickens for Sunday meals and we kids helped with those chores. We never thought anything about the processes used. 

I don't know if a small town butcher or farmer is more or less humane with animals. I do know that agribusiness uses horrid procedures. I first became aware of it reading Upton Sinclair, The Jungle, before I went away to college. 

I know my father and grandfather did not use good hygiene in their procedures and only realized that after growing into adulthood.  I tried to talk to Dad's sister about her memories, and she was incensed that I even asked questions. It was years later that she refused to discuss family violence and assured me I told the truth but should not talk about it. 

Silence is not the answer in the face of cruelty, bad sanitation, inhumane treatment of people or animals or soils. 

I have a theory that people, even several generations removed from active religious practices, continue to act according the religious teachings.

1. Man has the right of dominion, whether over wives, children or any living thing, flora or fauna.

2. Man is entitled to the goods and services of others without regard for the cost to those affected.

3. Man passes beliefs on to future generations, even those who do no follow the active support of a church.  

I also think non-believers should speak up and challenge those who make claims they cannot support, i.e. god answers prayers, there is a god who listens, there is a heaven or hell, a savior is there to take care of us, who is a sacrificial lamb for believers.

These are simple delusions that should not be difficult to take on. 


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