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Godless in the garden


Godless in the garden

Welcome to gardeners, growers of veggies, fruits, flowers, and trees!  


Welcome  backyard hen enthusiasts, worm farmers, beekeepers & composters!

Location: Planet Earth
Members: 169
Latest Activity: 9 hours ago

Welcome to Eden!

If you like to dig in the dirt, plant & prune, grow food & flowers, or sit and watch as someone else does your landscaping, you'll find something here to discuss!

Selected topics, in sort of alphabetical order:
Aging.  Gardening with an older body.
bees.  insectary.  insectsbee gardening. Beneficial insects.  insects drive evolution

Compost.  herecontaminated compost.

Backyard Chickens here. here. here. here.

Edible yard.  here  urban farmfront yards.
Growing Fruits


Fragrance and Scenthere.
Fruit growing.  in a small space, by backyard orchard culture.
Frugal gardening.  labels.

Gardening for future generations.  also permaculture, trees, historic varieties, soil

Hegelkultur here, here, here

Heritage and historic varieties.   heresources

locally grown plants to prevent blight transmission here.

Moon Phase Widget here. Moon phase topic here.

PeppersHot peppers.

Permaculture MollisonFalk  Liu, Joan's IntroTransformation in 90 days, Perm Principles at work. Food forest, Holzer

Potatoes.  here.

Rooftop gardening.  here

Seed starting. starting spring crops.

Scientific Gardening.   The Informed Gardener.  The truth about garden remedies.

Soil and soil building - healthy soil microbes, mycelium, dirt is everything, soil analysissoil pH.


Tomatoes.  Myths and truths

Trees.  Tree tunnels.  Ancient tree planting. Plant commemorative trees

Discussion Forum

Yacouba Sawadogo, 'the man who stopped the desert'

Started by Joan Denoo. Last reply by Joan Denoo 17 hours ago. 2 Replies

Stressed Bees

Started by Patricia. Last reply by Patricia Feb 12. 2 Replies

Permaculture U. of Mass

Started by Joan Denoo Jan 16. 0 Replies

"All I want for christmas is....."

Started by Daniel W. Last reply by Larry Dec 26, 2014. 8 Replies

Gardening in central Texas "pan" soil

Started by Joan Denoo. Last reply by Barbara Livingston Dec 25, 2014. 3 Replies

An Old Lady's Hugelkultur Bed

Started by Barbara Livingston. Last reply by Randall Smith Dec 10, 2014. 3 Replies

Comment Wall


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Comment by Daniel W on December 11, 2012 at 8:50pm

You are all teaching me a lot.

Comment by Joan Denoo on December 11, 2012 at 8:21pm
Spud, that is exactly what I thought, desert soils would be alkaline. It feels good to correct an assumption. Thanks.
Comment by Idaho Spud on December 11, 2012 at 4:45pm

My first thought was wrong also, but my first google reference agrees with Joan's.  It's

It starts by saying:  We often hear references to desert soil being alkaline. Maybe this is because there are so many alkali dry lakes in the desert, the assumption is that desert soils must also be alkaline. Cacti in their natural habitat get their water directly from rain. These plants normally grow on a minimum of soil in rocky areas. Many appear to come out of cracks in the rock. The pH of rain is acidic due to the carbon dioxide from the atmosphere dissolving in the rain water. It is this water that the cacti prefer. 


Comment by Daniel W on December 11, 2012 at 2:52pm


All I can say to that would be via googling on it, so your guess is as good as mine.

Humic acid is part of what is in humus, which is one of the important parts of compost.  I use lots of compost in all of my gardening, but I have not used purified humic acid.

All I can think of is to follow the label instructions.  I don't think it will hurt anything, but I'm not familiar with it.

This is from one web site:  

Humic acids - the fraction of humic substances that is not soluble in water under acidic conditions (pH < 2) but is soluble at higher pH values. They can be extracted from soil by various reagents and which is insoluble in dilute acid. Humic acids are the major extractable component of soil humic substances. They are dark brown to black in color.

I don't know that humic acid would acidify soil so much as bring it closer to the middle.  It buffers the soil.  It would take a chemist to explain that.  also info here.

Hope that's a little helpful!

Comment by Joan Denoo on December 11, 2012 at 1:55pm

Amer, I don't grow cactus but Dallas and Sentient Biped do. Perhaps they can give you some clues about when and how much to give. My guess, just on principle, is that cactus do not require acidic fertilizer. Oh Boy! I could be very wrong on cactus culture so don't trust my word. Much as I would like to speak with some knowledge.

What I am going to do now is Google "cactus culture", or "cactus management". 

The Cultivation Page about growing cacti & other succulent plants

Oh! I was wrong! Jeez! I really love it when I find out I am wrong and have a more accurate bit of knowledge. This article states, "Most cacti and succulent plants prefer a slightly acidic compost (pH6). If in doubt, this is the best choice for most species, but also avoid watering with strongly alkaline tap water. Simple, affordable pH meters are sold in many garden centres."

This article is really full of information and easy to access specific information. 


CACTUS CULTURE FOR AMATEURS  This is an old publication from England, but it is chuck full of information instructing Brits on how to grow cactus. "as in the case of almost every one of our cultivated plants, it is important to the cultivator to know something of the conditions which Nature has provided for Cactuses in those lands where they are native."

CACTUS  This is a modern cactus cultivation article. 

Well, this should get you started, and with a nice conversation with Sentient Biped or Dallas, you should be well launched. 





Comment by Joan Denoo on December 11, 2012 at 1:28pm

If the plants are dormant, you should honor that dormancy. They get their yearly rest and then come forth with full vigor during their growing season. Withhold fertilizer, except in very dilute amounts, until March or April. 
Soil is easily burned, either by heat or chemicals. If you notice ground under a campfire it is usually burned to clay and that is often what is found in archeology digs: burned soil. All living organisms are killed including plant life, seeds and roots, worms, fungus and any organic life. 

To burn with chemicals is to put too strong a dose of commonly used garden products on organic material (living material). Nitrogen is a most often seen. Have you ever noticed a lawn that has had fertilizer spread over the grass, and some grasses die? That is a chemical burn. Any acidic or alkaline fertilize has the capacity to burn leaves and roots if too much is applied. 

Comment by amer chohan on December 11, 2012 at 12:23pm

Joan, you mentioned it in your comment it would be easy to burn the soil. what is "burning of the soil"?

Comment by amer chohan on December 11, 2012 at 7:04am

Thanks Joan, what I make from all of this is to apply it in very low concentrations. I was told by the seller to do it in a water mixture. I am not in postion of experiment because my plants are in a dormancy state. Anything during this winter period effects them severly. It is not clear does Humaic acid increases soil acidity or not. One thing is for sure, my cactus are acidic loving plants. But I already use many things for the purpose and my soil is already at low PH. Further decrease would be a trouble.

Comment by Joan Denoo on December 10, 2012 at 8:07pm

Amer, I put in a "Google Alert" and I am getting responses back. Here is one that just came in:

100% Water Soluble Powder of Humic / Amino Acids and Fe Chelate

Comment by Joan Denoo on December 10, 2012 at 7:43pm

I forgot to tell you that Humic Acid is a principal component of humic substances, the major organic components of soil in peat bogs, stagnant lakes; It comes from brown water ponds and is made from decomposing dead organic matter. Its common use is as a soil supplement in gardens. I do buy bales of humus when I am building up my acid gardens. 



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