LGBTQI atheists, nontheists, and friends

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LGBTQI atheists, nontheists, and friends

Nontheist lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, and intersex people & friends.

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Comment by Darren Taggart on August 20, 2011 at 2:48am

I get that it was a holocaust joke. I'm not trying to show that it was funny.  Other people's reaction whether light or serious doesn't change the facts or improve their position.  There are lots of very serious priests and lots of very humorous oncologists.

I'm sure that a muslim feels very justified in their real offence; it would be wrong though to think that you or I have a monopoly on what 'justifies' offence; people can choose to take offence at whatever they like.  Holocaust 'humour' is tasteless, I agree, and the extermination of people, whether wasteful or not is clearly horrific.  However the point is that why should people care that something offends you?  You haven't actually been damaged by it, have you?  Presumably you can tell the difference between killing people and joking about it can't you?

I'm certainly not telling holocaust jokes and the only thing I'm taking lightly is vicarious offence; I think it's as ridiculous as vicarious responsibility.

My worry would be that some idiot brings in laws to avoid offence, like the old blasphemy laws we had here.

Comment by Darren Taggart on August 20, 2011 at 12:23am

Hi Sentient, I didn't actually see what caused such offence, but you've hit the nail on the head.  When Muslims see pictures of Mo, they don't like it because it 'trivializes' what's going on in their heads and they expect us to all treat the same things the same.  This is a similar hair trigger thing I think. 

It's the people who take vicarious offence; on behalf of others, who expect the same treatment as those actually affected that are trivializing them.  It's like John Prescott (a Labour Peer) getting all offended that his work phone was hacked expecting the same level of sympathy that Milly Dowler's (Murdered school girl whose phone was hacked) family received.  It smacks of not being able to tell the difference and expecting to be indulged.

I think that a lot of the offendees claiming to be offended to the point where they think people are interested, often have no more been affected by the subject of the 'joke' than the teller.  It might be horrifically bad taste to draw pictures of prophets or whatever, but I'm not sure one can even equate the trivialized memories of an 'offended' 30 year old with the actual suffering of those who went through actual horror. If we gayers pandered to the 'offence' taken by others or took serious offence at all the slights against us, maybe we'd be called Dours!

 

Although maybe I was out when we all agreed on the list of things we're not allowed to joke about.

 

But then I worry that (apparently) a lack of empathy is a sign of a sociopath...

 

Comment by Sentient Biped on August 19, 2011 at 9:13pm
on the other hand, this makes me laugh every time I view it.


Funny: Gay Jesus will survive by pmppm
Comment by Sentient Biped on August 19, 2011 at 9:09pm
Coming into this late.... and just to put in my own 2 cents. I empathize with someone who, having had relatives die in the holocaust, saw a cartoon which trivialized that memory. I admit my own sense of humor is very dry and very cynical. Gallows humor. So I should laugh at that cartoon, but all I could think was that the artist must be compensating for a very small penis and the fact that people point at him and laugh in the shower room.
Comment by Darren Taggart on August 19, 2011 at 2:21pm
Yeah he looks almost... vulnerable, you know? ;)
Comment by A Former Member on August 19, 2011 at 1:43pm

Yeah, with all that fair skin and blonde hair the people must have thought he was some kind of god.

 

Oh, wait....

Comment by A Former Member on August 19, 2011 at 1:35pm

This is what Jesus really looked like.

 

Comment by A Former Member on August 19, 2011 at 1:32pm
Jews have big noses?
Comment by A Former Member on August 19, 2011 at 1:30pm

Dominic, I know a few racist and gay jokes too that I think are quite funny. I think part of it depends on the context in which they are told, and who is telling them. A gay person can get away telling a gay joke when a straight person could not.

 

I think it also depends on who is the butt of the joke. A holocaust joke that makes fun of Hitler may be funny whereas one that makes fun of the Jews he murdered would not be.

 

I think it is also easier to make fun of anonymous people or groups of people than it is to make fun of specific individuals. I thought your child molester joke was twisted, but still funny. But why? I'm not sure. Certainly I don't approve of harming children. And if the joke was about a specific child victim, it most definitely would not be funny. IDK, humor/offense is such a difficult thing to understand.

 

I think I knew a gay pedophile joke once that was funny, but I sure can't remember it now. Something about his lover turning 10....

 

Anyway, the issue with T. Morgan is that he is an actual person and his son is too. It's horrible for any parent to say anything like that about their own children for any reason whatsoever.

 

Do ya'll remember when Joan Rivers made jokes about her husband's suicide? I don't remember the jokes, but I remember the controversy. Rivers felt like she had the right to make those jokes if she wanted.

Comment by Dominic Florio on August 19, 2011 at 1:09pm

Humor is subjective, but I often enjoy racist, sexist etc humor.  Everyone who knows me, knows that I'm none of those things.  I'm laughing at a stereotype.  I am also smart enough, not to tell these types of jokes around people who do not know me well.  I do not want them to think that I believe in the premise of the joke or that I want to spread hate.

In my view, the recent controversy over Tracey Morgan's comments, saying that he would stab his son if he was gay, just wasn't funny, at least to me.  He could have portrayed himself as a homophobe and I could find humor in that, but the violence turned me off.  I guess we all have our limits.

Here is an example of a joke that left me laughing and uncomfortable, at the same time.  Many times, we deal with tragic situations with humor, but it in no way trivializes the severity of the situation or the need for society to take positive actions to make life better for all.

"A child molester and a little girl were walking into the woods at dusk.  The little girl looked up at the child molester and stated that she was scared.  The child molseter commented, "How do you think I feel, I have to walk back alone in the dark."

Maybe the difference between this and Tracey Morgan, is that although the actions of the child molester are shocking, they are not out of the ordinary for the character.  The humor lies in the fact that we switch our attention away from the violence and onto the unexpected emotion of the molester.

The actions of Tracey Morgan, as a homophobic dad, were not in line with the situation.  It could have been funny if he said something such as, he was going to force his son to read muscle magazines until he became straight, as an example.

But again, I guess it is all subjective.  It helps to know the mindset and intent of the person telling or posting the jokes.

I taught handicapped kids for years and I love handicap jokes.  But let someone make fun of one of my kids while we were out in public, and I would want to tear them a new one. 

 

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