This was brought to my attention by my former business partner. Now some of us were in uniform prior to the events of Sept. 11, 2001. Well, starting back in the early 90's the military started to take DNA samples of all it's service members. The reason for this was simple. If you got killed in combat, and had lost your dog tags or had decomposed, they could use your DNA to identify your body and bring you home. No more Unknown Soldiers.
That meant something to me. And others. Should I die in combat, and my body lost and not found for years or decades, they could eventually ID me and bring me home and to my family. My family could then get on with their lives and not suffer as countless other families had in the past.
Well guess what. Not now boys and girls.
Did you know that under the Patriot Act, ever time a DNA sample is run YOUR DNA is also checked to see if YOU ARE THE SUSPECT!? Isn't that GREAT!
Yes by serving your country you place yourself under the suspect list. Now, there are those who will say, and I quote, "If you have nothing to hide then you're got nothing to worry about..." Well my response to that is this,
"IF I HAVE NOTHING TO HIDE THEN WHY ARE YOU INVESTIGATING ME?"
Ya know, this isn't a TV show like CSI (which as you know is make believe). We’re talking about people who have served their country. One of my biggest beefs with Mr. Bush and Company is that you have a ton of those who got out of doing military service during Vietnam in his administration. Now I know that military service is not required to be a public servant or a politician. I don’t want it to be.
But I have very serious issues with the Patriot Act. Specially since the “Father” of the Patriot Act spent his formative years in Communist Vietnam. And he is also a big catholic bible pounder and has worked on some “prayer” related cases. His name is Viet Dinh.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viet_D._Dinh
So, should any of you decide to quit the straight and narrow, I just want you to be aware that they already have your DNA.
And by the way, should you piss someone off, and they get some of your hair, they go and commit a crime or kill someone and leave your hair at the crime site, you might just find yourself in prison. I mean, with your DNA at the crime seen, as you may well know from watching such shows as CSI, you’re off to prison. For life. Or if you’re really lucky, the death penalty.
Nice to know this is what a vet can face. Now if they’d only make it so where all our government employees and elected officials had to give up their DNA as well….
Now after reading this, what is your take on all this.
PS. I always get a kick out of watching CSI when they have a suspect and they are grilling him.
Grissom: "We found your DNA in the national data base."
Suspect: "Yes I kow, I was in the Army (Navy, Marines, Air Force)..."
Rrrrrrright.....

Views: 9

Replies to This Discussion

Just for your own FYI, Dinh was also part of Ashcroft's morning prayer circle. Now that, especially in the head offices of the Department of Justice should scare anyone.
And I came up with this also....

Do check it out.
http://www.nndb.com/people/273/000044141/
I think you're being a little paranoid about DNA.

First, soldiers have been in the databanks for fingerprints for decades, and few of those prints found at crime scenes have resulted in false arrests. If your prints are on the suspected weapon in a crime, on the other hand...

Second, DNA matching has been going on since before the Patriot Act, in a great many locations.

Third, these CSI type shows are FICTION. Yes, much of the science is accurate, but it's not realistic. Investigation does not work that way in real life. Civilian CS employees don't interrogate jack shit, much less carry guns as part of their job. They collect the data at the scene (even the weird stuff that detectives insist on having), and run tests--when they can get around to it. If they have access to a lab, much less one as sophisticated as CSI's.

And, by the way, DNA isn't a magic bullet answer to anything in criminal cases, much less over hair. There are usually plenty of other things to look for besides DNA at a scene, and those things can convict just as well as DNA. Even if there isn't much evidence, the sad truth is that most people are killed by someone they know, and that's where cops go looking first. They can find the inconsistencies in alibis or whereabouts, and even get a confession before one test result comes back. Forensics is just icing on the cake. Not that forensics can't nail someone. It can. It just doesn't happen anywhere near as often as CSI has led people to believe.

Finally, most criminals aren't smart/controlled enough to pull off setting up someone with forensic evidence. I know that scenario makes for some exciting drama, but it's just not all that common in real life.
The data bases also include Police & firefighters.
^^ I agree with Aquaria ^^
"So, should any of you decide to quit the straight and narrow, I just want you to be aware that they already have your DNA."

This is good advice.

"And by the way, should you piss someone off, and they get some of your hair, they go and commit a crime or kill someone and leave your hair at the crime site, you might just find yourself in prison."

This is silly.

"...you may well know from watching such shows as CSI."

Sounds like someone has been watching too much TV.

I want to be friends here, and the Patriot Act has some serious warts, but I think it's fair for us atheists to be a bit skeptical. Collecting DNA in a database is not a bad idea. Living in fear of being framed for a crime probably isn't necessary.
I guess what bothers me the most about this is that our DNA was and is collected originally to identify our bodies if we get killed when there is no other way to do so.
Then to have it tossed into the Patriot Act so the government can have more DNA samples to try and match just rubs me the wrong way.
I don't see any of our elected officials or their families having to give the government their DNA. I am not aware of any state or federal requirements of taking someone who is arrected and getting a sample of their DNA. When they book someone they take their prints. Do they also take their DNA?
And what about government employees? Are theirs taken as well?
I guess being told that taking our DNA was initically for one thing and then using it for another, well, just makes me feel kind of betrayed by my government, that I elected to serve.
I agree with you. The first thing the blind and ignorant will say is "if you're innocent, then why are you worried about it?" or "You are paranoid. Things will NEVER get THAT bad."

Just like with firearm registrations, the 'reasons' behind a new policy or law is for the 'safety and benefit' of people. Invasions of Privacy and personal information gathering is always justified this way.

The best advise I would give to all of you who will be asked to give a DNA sample during military In-processing and DO NOT WANT YOUR DNA TO BE FILED ON A DATABASE TO BE USED OUTSIDE OF LEGITIMATE MILITARY REASONS, is to FAKE the actual act of rubbing the cotton swab against the inside of your cheek. When I went therough In-processing in 1997, we were handed out the swabs. There was no direct observation, (40 +/- persons in class). A day or two after 9/11, we again took the same DNA process as we were prepared for deployment. Again, no supervision. Now, although I personally DID give my DNA samples, if I were asked to give them again today, I'd have a hard time agreeing.

Thank you for posting this.
In short, we were told one thing and given another. I don't see our elected officials giving DNA samples.
It really grinds my gears when "my" government does these things and doesn't even ask. They just assume.
So now, I get tossed in with criminals for serving my country.
You watch these shows like CSI and they run someones DNA. Well it comes up in the national data base and they respond that they were in the military. The CSI character throws it at them like they are all of the sudden guilty.
WHAT THE F**K is that all about? You serve you country, which is more then a hell of a lot of the people in this country are willing to do, and then you get tossed in with criminal suspects.
I'm for getting rid of the Patriot Act. All it is in my opion is just a cover up for a bunch of lazy government employees who did't do their job which lead up to the attacks on 9-11.
Well........actually, CID is checking for DNA on certain belongings of mine right now to see if they can use it to pin down the guy who recently assaulted me...who is another Soldier in my unit! So yes, Soldiers can be suspects too...after all, they are human...and if I was denied the right to investigate this case because Soldiers' DNA was protected from such use, I would be livid.
Just because someone hadn't got in trouble before, or got it waivered, to enlist in the US military, does not preclude the possibility of their being an asshole rapist or other criminal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
OK...I'll stop now before I get too mad.............................
It seems that the point of my concern has been missed in all of this.
This in not about paranoia.
This is about what we were told the US Military vis-à-vis government was going to use our DNA for. If we got killed and we didn’t have a “meat tag” or dental records were not useful, or the dog tags were lost, they could use the DNA to IDENTIFY OUR BODIES.
You know, like the UNKNOWN from Vietnam who was finally IDENTIFIED.
It gives closure to the family.
No one said, that our DNA was going to be put in a national data base that is use in criminal investigations.
The only time, and I mean the ONLY time I’ve had my DNA taken is by the military.
Now, OK, I totally understand that a TV SHOW IS JUST MAKE BELIEVE. OK…. The CSI shows are just TV shows…
I’m an educated man.
I know and understand these things.
BUT…
I do not see any law enforcement officials, or government officials, or elected officials having to give their DNA up.
Nor do I see them offering up their DNA to be placed in a data base that is used for criminal investigations.
Now, what I want to know is why am I and others having their DNA put in that data base?
Are we criminals?
Are we suspects?

By joining the military did we give up or surrender our “Rights” as American citizens?
Do the Recruiters tell enlistees this before they sign up?
I don’t see black helicopters circling around my home or work….
OK?
No one is tailing me….
OK?
I am NOT trying to stop any CRIMINAL INVESTIGATIONS.
I also understand the limitations of DNA.
Look at the O. J. Simpson trial.
As I stated in another post, the “If you’ve got nothing to hide….” approach is just BS. Especially when those who say that are not or ever have served in the military.
My answer to that, “If you’ve got nothing…” is this:
IF I HAVE NOTHING TO HIDE THEN WHY ARE YOU INVESTIGATING ME?
If you don’t think you could find yourself under scrutiny, think again. I know a fellow service member who did investigative work. Just for the hell of it he ran his name in a National Criminal data base.
Guess what?
His name was in it….
It seems that his ex wife, who also did investigations for the service put his name in the data base. You know, just one little “got ya” in the settlement.
Needless to say, he got it fixed….really quick.
But do you have that luxury of running your name through the system to see if, by some chance that low and behold you’re in that data base? And can you get it fixed? And if they can, how long would it take? It doesn’t take any time to create a mistake, but it can take years to correct one.
Now think about this: How many times have you been told if you have a pay problem go to……. And how long did it take to fix it?
I served my country. No one forced me to do so. When my country call, I went. There isn’t a draft. No one is forced to serve in the US Military today.
I guess my concern is this:
What have I and others like myself, done, or why do I and others like myself, deserve to have OUR information placed in a data base used for criminal investigations when WE’VE done nothing to warrant that information being placed in it?
I just see it as wrong.

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