Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Calvin on October 28, 2008 at 12:40am

I totally agree with you that it should be taken out of the oath, but I don’t think I’m as upset about it as you are.

Hawaii is really divers, so we really don’t have that Bible belt mentality like the mainland. The religious presser we get comes mainly from external institutions outside of Hawaii, like “under God” in the Pledge of Allegiance, and “in God we trust” on our money. There’s not that kind of religious presser coming from within Hawaii; we were the first state in the Union to legalize abortion, so we really don’t feel that oppressed here.

I have to say that I love my country and I’ve been in uniform my entire adult life, with that said, I got to tell you growing up as an American not being white, not being Christian, thousand of miles away from mainland America, you kind of feel like you’re on the outside looking in, you kind of grow up excepting a lot of things from mainland society that you feel like you really don’t have any control over.

The last time I reenlisted, my commander got to the “so help me God” part, I looked directly at him, he looked at me and said in an apologetic voice “I know you’re Buddhist and you don’t believe in God, this is just what's written on the paper” so I said it. I didn’t think making an issue of it to my commander, who has been extremely supportive of me for many years, would have solved anything or have been productive.

Although I’m not as upset about it as you seem to be, I do totally agree with you that all religious references should be taken out of our government, and now as an adult, I do feel we have the power to change things.

Permalink Reply by heretic on October 29, 2008 at 12:34am

Yeah, it does need to be taken out. Everytime i reenlist, i tell the officer beforehand, i will not say, so help me GOD. i tell him (well so far they've only been 'hes') that i don't believe in god, don't want to appeal to an imaginary being in my oath, and will only say, "so help me". which i do. and i've never had a problem reenlisting. they're trying to make it a theocracy but on my small level i'm fighting it every f**kin step of the way...
-jillian

Permalink Reply by World Walker on November 6, 2008 at 1:32pm

There's definitely a real gray area between the reality that atheists are outnumbered and that our lack of belief is as significant to us as someone else's belief. I could care less what they do with oaths because swearing to God is meaningless enough it seems somewhat additionally meaningless to protest that action. It's not as if the military is squared away with every other thing except having God in its oaths. Quite the opposite, the military is a brilliant experiment in daily chaos, the least of which is a fairly common appeal to some being that I have never seen help.

Permalink Reply by Aquaria on December 3, 2008 at 4:19am

I didn't pretend to repeat it when I enlisted. I stopped at "me." I also crossed out the God part on my contract. I told the applicable personnel that it would be lying for me to say/sign anything attributing my actions to something I didn't believe in. Nobody gave me any grief about it. Of course, this was in the 80s. I understand things have gotten a lot worse about the religion issue since then.

And I would have laughed in the face of someone who was yelling at me to sound off at a mass oath, BEFORE I was fully enlisted. It's the equivalent of yelling demands at a star athlete or actor when he's got the pen to the paper to sign a contract.

Sheesh, have some ovaries, and tell jerks like that to lighten up.

Permalink Reply by Dennis M. Dutton on December 4, 2010 at 12:58pm

I don't remeber the oath itself being on the actual contract. Last year I reenlisted for my fifth and final time and don't recall the oath being part of the actual enlistmen/re-enlistment contract of the DOD.

Permalink Reply by Zachary Jennings on March 31, 2011 at 8:17am

I do not know about other branches of serivce but in the Army if you wanted to enlist or renlist you could switch from "I swear..." to "I affirm..." the difference is they omit the phrase "So help me God." if you used affirm. That is what i used to enlist in the military and wrote on my contract.

Permalink Reply by S Davenport on April 23, 2011 at 2:23pm

Anyone else get "No Preference" printed on your dog tags after saying atheist? That ticked me off, no pref sounds like you couldn't make up your mind. Does the MRFF have a page on your site? They are a great resource for the non christians in the military. Love the  site. Good work.

Permalink Reply by amanda alexander on June 18, 2011 at 1:51am

I got athiest, you shoulda said something... Someone in my basic had that pulled on them and I battled them over to the drill to get it fixed... But I have military background so I know the regs pretty well and they didn't want to loose their stripes

Permalink Reply by David Rogala on May 27, 2011 at 12:51pm

I have re-enlisted several times now and have always told the presiding officer to leave out the "so help me god" line.  I've actually never once had anyone question it.  I'd have to look it up to be 100% sure, but I believe that the re-enlistment oath on the paperwork even identifies that phrase as optional.

Permalink Reply by Dennis M. Dutton on June 5, 2011 at 2:25pm

the last line is optional by both fedral law and military regulations down to each individual branch. If you are told otherwise, then you have a valid issue.

Permalink Reply by amanda alexander on June 18, 2011 at 1:49am

I didn't have to say it. They told all athiests to just not say the words when I came in. I don't think it should be there at all because some people have multiple gods and like us some people have none... but atleast they are trying to move forward... unless i just got off really easy when I joined

 

Permalink Reply by Tim on June 26, 2011 at 10:25am

I am NOT saying it for this re-enlistment.  They can kick me the f**k out and find someone who can do my job better, or they can just take my word for it, instead of making me appeal to the imaginary sky-fairy.  They take my word for everything else, and I deliver, so this should be no different.  If they push it on me, we're going to have a contest of wills, not a battle of wits.

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