Amanda Marcotte has a great post up at Pandagon: Theocratic or pro-choice: Not much middle ground between them

Basically, a blogger called The Raving Antiabortionst Atheist recently converted to Christianity (as Marcotte predicted 2 years ago, though perhaps he did this as a prank) after years of trying to find secular justification for his anti-abortion arguments. Amanda makes some great points about how there really is no rational secular argument against legal abortion.

Check it out!

Tags: abortion, anti-abortion, anti-choice, anti-feminism, atheism, conversion, feminism, freedom from religion, fundies, human sexuality, More…misogyny, patriarchy, politics, pro-choice, pro-life, religion, reproductive health, reproductive justice, reproductive rights, sexism, theocracy

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Replies to This Discussion

If I found pregnancy to be less often acceptable than unacceptable as a consequence of sexual intercourse, then it would certainly not be any more worth preserving than an STD. In my mind however, pregnancy is more often acceptable than unacceptable, even though I admit that it's not necessarily always acceptable.

"If you decide to apply the logic of 'responsibility', you must be consistent with it. You've argued that, responsibly, the consequences should be accepted without being abated or eliminated entirely. I see two problems with this - the first is that it would be impossible to act responsibly after first making a decision, since acting would alter the consequences of the previous act; the second (and lesser) is a question of definition, since your argument could be read to state that responsibility does not involve cleaning up after one's mess. I disagree heartily with your use of the word in regards to this argument."

If this is not related to STDs, which I already dealt with above, then I must admit that I have no understanding of what you mean by the first question. Secondly, if your second and lesser problem refers to pregnancy as the potential "mess", then my only objections would be justifications for legal prohibition, which however, I fear fall outside of the initial contradictions of this discussion.

Whether the lowering of the age threshold for choosing to have sex is necessarily a Bad Thing or not, my conclusion was nothing more than that acts which belittle the consequences of sex produces an impression which hides those consequences, and thus, the source of the lowered threshold is an impression which is far from accurate.
For a mother to kick her daughter out of the house for being pregnant, as in the anecdote, would not be entirely unjustified behavior. Unjustified behavior would however be that a mother would approve of an abortion more than she would approve of an unwanted pregnancy.

A mother could approve of an abortion b/c of the negative effects that an unwanted pregnancy would have on her daughter. Kicking one's daughter out of the house would be abandoning your kid, who you are legally obligated to care for. It sounds like here you are saying it's better to abandon your 15 year old than to not bring a fetus to life.

Actually, it is antisexual people who are more likely to have an abortion b/c they want to keep "scandals" at bay. I'm sure it happens in the families of pro-life politicians and religious leaders all the time.

About accepting the consequences of sex: abortion can be a consequence of sex too. It is costly, painful, and generally not a positive experience, especially considering the judgment and harassment that women get for it.
I am pro choice and I still thought it was biased. Different people will use logic and arrive at different viewpoints. I don't think it is impossible to be atheist and pro-life, although I think being feminist and actually wanting abortion outlawed (not to be confused with thinking abortion is wrong but not wanting to outlaw it) is another story.
Thanks for the link. I enjoyed the read immensely and the comments were just as enlightening. I agree with her on the position that there is no rational justification to strip women of their right to choice.

Also, her point on a conjoined person(s) is very interesting and one I had not heard before. Made a lot of sense. All in all, I found the blog very well thought out and relevant.

Oh, and just for the record...I'm pro-choice, pro-life and pro-secularism.

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