Theist or A-theist - is there really a need to choose from only these two narrow options?

An Atheist is someone who denies the existence of God. Right? 

I was disappointed to find that on applying for Atheist Nexus I was asked whether I was a theist (in which case I would be denied access) or an atheist (in which case I would be granted membership). 
This is however a very black and white way of looking at things - a bit like George Bush (God bless the little creep) saying "If you are not for us, you are against us!"

I'm neither for nor against GWB. I just want to be left in peace by this little twerp, as I don't care to take sides one way or the other, because polarisation is IMO not conducive to sane and rational thinking. 

It's the same with God. Why be a theist or an a-theist?  Isn't it enough for the sun to shine without crediting or blaming some supernatural entity for it, or denying that such an entity exists? 

I guess I'm a realist: I accept that whatever is, is. If there is such a thing as God, that's fine with me. If there isn't, that's equally fine with me. 

It seems to me that we live in stunningly beautiful universe which is permeated by an incredible intelligence, which unfortunately seems to elude so many people due to the fact that they allow perverted thinking to adulterate it. 

Such perverted thinking is IMO typically found in people who subscribe to organised religions, religions which have invented God realising that they can turn their invention into a marketable commodity and a tool for manipulating, controlling and exploiting the masses. 

Perverted thinking can however also be found among atheists who reduce the universe and the human being to a machine-like entity. 

The point I am getting to is that I wasn't quite truthful when I joined. I am not an atheist. Nor am I a theist. I am who I am. Now you can either throw me out, or allow me to stay and enter into a meaningful discussion! :-) 



  


 

 
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Permalink Reply by Roy The Infidel on September 28, 2010 at 3:45am
The World's Largest Community Exclusively For Nontheists!

You may delete your account or the site mods can do it for you.

You lie through your teeth and expect to have a meaningful discussion here?

Find another site to troll around.
Permalink Reply by Erwin Alber on September 28, 2010 at 4:12am
I didn't join to discuss atheism, but to discuss science topics. I'll only address the topic of atheism (vs non-theism) here, to clear up any confusion or misunderstanding about my stance.

I am not a theist and don't belong to any religion. Like my parents, I'm what one would call a free thinker. Isn't that good enough?

I think there is a difference between a non-theist and an atheist. I would describe myself as a non-theist, but not an a-theist. A non-theist is IMO someone for whom a belief in God is irrelevant, while an a-theist denies the existence of God. An a-theist still subscribes to a belief system (namely that there is no God), while a non-theist deems such a belief system (or in my case any belief system) irrelevant and consequently superfluous.

A-theism and non-theism are both based on dualistic belief systems, while non-theisms is based on the absence of belief and is consequently aligned with the unity and harmony inherent in nature and the cosmos.

It seems to me that anyone who subscribes to a belief system is then controlled by the ideology they subscribe to. Look at Communism vs Capitalism, Republicans vs Democrats. Theism and Atheism are likewise two sides of the same coin. Non-theism by contrast transcends duality and enables one to function on an entirely different level.

If anyone wants to terminate my membership, that's fine with me; I don't like to hang out with narrow-minded people anyway. I however have faith that (most) atheists are open-minded individuals who can see beyond the confines of belief systems. To do so is after all presumably the reason why they have left oppressive religious belief systems and become atheists in the first place.

I will however have to abide by whatever decision the moderator makes, and that's fine with me.
Permalink Reply by Roy The Infidel on September 28, 2010 at 4:23am
I would describe myself as a non-theist.

Well, then. I think we can have a meaningful discussion.
Permalink Reply by Erwin Alber on September 28, 2010 at 4:42am
Thank you Roy! :-)
Permalink Reply by Park Bierbower on October 4, 2010 at 12:50pm
i find it amazing that this hasn't been addressed on atheist nexus, but atheism is not a belief system. it isn't categorically similar to any other true belief system, because it requires a LACK of belief. it is not a "belief in no god" but a rejection of the claim that there is a god. if someone claims to you that the dallas cowboys are the BEST that will ever be, but do nothing to prove it, you may be uninclined to accept that notion. if like me, you may say "well show me why they are the best ever, and if it makes sense then i'll consider it." however, if you say you do not agree with said statement, you are not actively saying you are against them, you are simply stating you disagree with the statement to the affirmative. that is the difference between atheism and theism. theism is a positive assertion, where as atheism is a rejection of said assertion, not a positive assertion to the negative.
why that may seem a trivial difference, and even prone to semantics, it is not. its critical when understanding what beliefs people have and don't have, and they way they formulate them. i tend to state that I do not hold beliefs. it is true, however, that doesn't mean i'm not a person of ideas. my Ideas are based on evidence throughout my life, and are constantly expanding- but being ideas, they are much easier to change than beliefs.
just a thought and some clarification
Permalink Reply by Rob van Senten on October 7, 2010 at 9:24am
I guess I'm a realist: I accept that whatever is, is. If there is such a thing as God, that's fine with me. If there isn't, that's equally fine with me.

Some would call that Apatheism.

I am an atheist because I apply the principle of the Null Hypothesis to the question of the existence of deities. I'm not denying any specific God or Goddess, as a skeptic I simply demand to be convinced by evidence.

(I'm not an atheist) denying that such an entity exists

I'm not denying the existence of such an entity, just as I'm not denying Russell's Teapot, the Flying Spaghetti Monster or the Invisible Pink Unicorn either, I just lack a belief because I lack evidence to support the position that they do exist.

It seems to me that we live in stunningly beautiful universe which is permeated by an incredible intelligence ...

It seems to you, but what evidence do you have to support that position? Just because something seems to be so and so in your opinion has no value in an argument unless you provide evidence and arguments.

....which unfortunately seems to elude so many people due to the fact that they allow perverted thinking to adulterate it.

Or it eludes you that your perception of reality is just perception. It's not evidence for the validity of the argument that "an incredible intelligence permeates the universe". Even if it would seem to me that it would be the case, I would not go about arguing in support of that position because I lack evidence to do so.

Perverted thinking can however also be found among atheists who reduce the universe and the human being to a machine-like entity.

Can you please explain why it is perverted thinking to reduce the human to a machine like entity? Are biology and astronomy examples of this perverted thinking?

I accept that whatever is, is

Cognitive bias affects everybody.
Also, to be able to accept what is, you would have to have a method to distinguish what is from what isn't. How exactly are you going to do this, what method do you use?
Permalink Reply by Park Bierbower on October 7, 2010 at 9:44am
rob, i concur. no matter how you look at it, the human body IS a machine, albeit a Biological one. the universe is governed by mathematical laws, just as machines are- and yet, i don't see how that strips the beauty from it at all. i find it most beautiful that these simply truths that we have realized on our small planet in the backwaters of a small galaxy can ring true trillions of miles away, and permeate the entire universe itself. the beauty of such things comes from the so called "mechanization" not despite it

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