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The World's Largest Coalition of Nontheists and Nontheist Communities!
The United Socialist Federal Republic?
The economy in the United States is in a collapse. The Capitalist system does not work anymore; banks have become more powerful than our politicians. The government now has a policy based around
Fear and Greed. The rich are getting
richer and more powerful, while the great masses of America wallow in poverty.
Must we continue to exist in this passive state, only living to serve the rich and powerful? Or do
we, the great masses, stand up against the policies of Fear, and Greed, and
God? We must break the bonds that
separate us, we must pull down the centers of Greed and Fear and we must pull
down the houses of God.
These borders are created to separate us into individuals where we can be controlled easier.
We must stand up, against the tyranny of the centers of Greed, and Fear, and God; quoting John Adams: “People should not fear
government, government should fear people.”
Once we stand up to Fear, to Greed, to God, we will become united!
This being said, I advocate the collapse of the Capitalist system and the foundation of the United Socialist Federal Republic, in which
the government will exist to serve the people.
Capitalism is Dead. We must put
it out of it’s misery and move on toward Socialism.
http://www.thinkatheist.com/forum/topics/the-united-socialist-feder... (to view the 19 pages of discussion)
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Park Bierbower on -
Don't forget how deregulated their industries are, how toxic their water supply is, how they can force any citizen to move at any time, how polluted their air is, how unhealthy their people are, and how rampant corruption is in their government. their economic numbers may be large, but it seems to me that they correlate, in a way, with their military. staggering numbers with very little quality and training. quantity over quality, thats their motto.
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Permalink Reply by TNT666 on -
Yep, just as the 'economy' of Germany was at its strongest while it was trying to anhilate a huge chunk of its population... A 'strong' economy is about the least reliable indicator to assess quality of life.
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Permalink Reply by Dan DuPree on -
I know Wikipedia is not the most realible of sources for definitions, but it was the first hit and summed up what I see happening to our country very nicely.
"
Fascism (pronounced /ˈfæʃɪzəm/) is a radical and authoritarian nationalist political ideology.[1][2][3][4] Fascists seek to organize a nation according to corporatist perspectives, values, and systems, including the political system and the economy.[5][6] Fascism was originally founded by Italian national syndicalists in World War I who combined extreme Sorelian syndicalist political views along with nationalism.[7][8][9] Though normally described as being on the far right, there is a scholarly consensus that fascism was influenced by both the left and the right.[10][11][12][7][13]
Fascists believe that a nation is an organic community that requires strong leadership, singular collective identity, and the will and ability to commit violence and wage war in order to keep the nation strong.[14] They claim that culture is created by the collective national society and its state, that cultural ideas are what give individuals identity, and thus they reject individualism.[14] Viewing the nation as an integrated collective community, they see pluralism as a dysfunctional aspect of society, and justify a totalitarian state as a means to represent the nation in its entirety.[15][16]
They advocate the creation of a single-party state.[17] Fascist governments forbid and suppress opposition to the fascist state and the fascist movement.[18] They identify violence and war as actions that create national regeneration, spirit and vitality.[19]
Fascism rejects the concepts of egalitarianism, materialism, and rationalism in favor of action, discipline, hierarchy, spirit, and will.[20] They oppose liberalism (as a bourgeois movement) and Marxism (as a proletarian movement) for being exclusive economic class-based movements.[21] Fascists present their ideology as that of an economically trans-class movement that promotes ending economic class conflict to secure national solidarity.[22] They believe that economic classes are not capable of properly governing a nation, and that a merit-based elite of experienced military persons must rule through regimenting a nation's forces of production and securing the nation's independence.[23] Fascism perceives conservatism as partly valuable for its support of order in society but disagrees with its typical opposition to change and modernization.[24] Fascism presents itself as a solution to the perceived benefits and disadvantages of conservatism by advocating state-controlled modernization that promotes orderly change while resisting the dangers to order in society of pluralism and independent initiative.[24]"
We do not have a government that exist for the benefit of it's citizens. We have one party masqerading as two that do the bidding of a Ruling Corporate Elite. With the Supreme Court ruling for "Citizens United" that Cabal now has the 'personhood". They can spend more money on elections than any individual or group and don't have to report how that money is spent. If this seems like hyperbole, I suggest you read this to understand that if very nearly happened in the 1930's, and the Bush family and there financial monster USB were at the center of it.
http://www.infowars.com/articles/bush/fascist_coup_owes_to_bush_naz...
This is not conspiracy BS. This is documented in our own congressional record and the story was researced and backed up by British Public Radio.
Obama is just a kinder, gentler face for the same agenda. It makes it palatible for the liberals for a few years, then destroys anything that may be progress in the next campaign of fear and war mongering. Nazism has elements of Socialism in order to create a citizenry that operates for the benefit of the Nazi/Corporate elite. It uses all of the fear and hate tactics of Hitler's Third Reich so it embraces the racism and bigotry of conservatism.
If we are a socialist nation, it is corporate socialism that is the strongest element of what we get when it is all said and done.
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Permalink Reply by Park Bierbower on
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isn't corporate socialism just corporatism? I agree, and while I (only feel) think that Obama isn't intentionally part of that system, I wouldn't disagree with saying that he is. How is a two party system that much better than a One party system? now that those two parties are institutionalized, it really is just a one party system.
~thanks for sharing that wiki entry, I like that nearly half of those qualities mentioned above are tactics that have been used over the last ten years to rally americans behind the governments cause.~
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Permalink Reply by Park Bierbower on
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here we go..
as you read through that, consider these things we have been told.
"we need to stand together as Americans"(nationalism)
" the wars are a necessity for freedom"(afghanistan and IRAQ)
"if you don't agree, you are being un-american and unpatriotic" (attacks on dissent)
" mr. beck's and fox news attacks on progressivism and liberalism (anti-egalitarianism) and attack/ignore any class based argument for equality"
" again, we are all americans and the homeland is the most important thing (rejection of classes, unifying ALL americans under one label)"
Like I said, just about half. I don't know if I would go as far as to say we are a fascist government, but it is interesting the similarities between the two.
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Permalink Reply by Dan DuPree on
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Please take time to read the piece on the Bush Family legacy of the attempted fascist coup. The Ford family and GE were two of the biggest cash contributors. When US troops arrived in Berlin at the end of WWII, they were able to repair their trucks from parts from many German military vehicles. They were both running Ford engines. The the finacial and very secret side of the Bush Cabal, USB run by the Walker family, as in Geo. Herbert Walker Bush had their US assets froven for two yrs during WWII because they wouldn't stop moving money for the Third Reich. This is not something frivolous. They have been planning this for generations. Pappy Bush remains a power behind the CIA as well as the most frequent Chairman of the Board of the Carlisle Group, the military investment fund that can only be joined by invitiation and controls some of our largest military suppliers. Cheney has spent several careers as SecDef, State Department and VP securing the channels of military procurment so there have been more contractors than US troops in Iraq since it began and Haliburton, KRB and their subsideraries have swindled many, many billions from US and the Iraqi people. It makes it easier to see how we have reached this point where its hard to call us anything else but a Fascist nation.
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Permalink Reply by Sendero Rojo on -
I’m a proud communist (Maoist). I stand in complete solidarity with the Maoists in India and against the fascist state of India who‘re currently engaged in the genocidal Operation Green Hunt.
I have read through this whole thread and haven’t seen a proper definition of genuine socialism or communism.
Socialism is the phase just after the common people have seized state power, the phase between capitalism and communism in which the wealth of society, which is currently concentrated in the hands of the capitalist class, is re-distributed and the means of production (factories, farms etc..) are being placed into common ownership. There's no such thing as a permanent socialism. You’ll either have leadership (the ideas that people are led by) with proper vision to lead humanity to communism, a -->world<-- free of all forms of exploitation and oppression, a world without classes, without states, without money, where goods are being produced 100% for need and the means of production are held in common.), or the forces created by allowing individuals or groups of individuals (even the revolutionary state itself) will take society back down the capitalist road.
Labor is the only thing that produces wealth and under capitalism the vast majority of that wealth is legally stolen by the capitalist class and used to further solidify their power over the common people. (We live under the dictatorship of the capitalist class, see my post on this site entitled Democracy or Dictatorship?) During genuine socialism this wealth is beginning to be redistributed. Socialism is a violent, bloody, and turbulent period. It would be fantastic if it were not the case, but there will never be a time when the capitalist class will say “oh, here’s this group talking about bring forth a new way, lets just give them the keys and see how they do.” No, they (and their allies) will fight to the death for their “right” to exploit the Earth and its inhabitants. They will do all they can to create a “the sky is falling” atmosphere and the first time someone’s falafel is a bit overcooked, or there’s a shortage of something at the store, or any number of things that is bound to happen when society is going through such a turbulent period, they will succeed in winning a following in favor of going back to the old ways. Bottom line, you will not succeed in digging up the roots of the capitalist system, placing the means of production into common ownership, unless you’re at least prepared to do so with armed force. The capitalist class must be suppressed out of existence (as a class, not as individuals).
Furthermore socialism will not spring up all around the world at once. It will exist only in one part of the world and it will be surrounded by hostile forces. You must have a People’s Army to protect what you’ve won, otherwise capitalist forces elsewhere in the world will easily crush you and take all that you’ve won. Genuine socialism has only existed two times in the capitalist era, in the USSR from 1917-1956 and in China from 1949-1976. These revolutions both achieved great things, but were reversed by the forces of the old order, and by the leadership as glorious as it was, running up against the limits of their understandings. There were real errors made in these attempts at revolution, and no one in their right mind should advocate that we look at Marxism-Leninism-Maoism as a doctrine, but rather it should be looked at as a science in which we learn from our mistakes and forge a new synthesis on the way forward based upon the current conditions humanity is facing.
In order to stand a chance of defeating the capitalist class dictatorship you must have leadership with proper vision. Many bad things have been done in the name of socialism and communism. Avoid like the plague any communist party that does not educate far and wide about the real dangers of the vanguard turning into it’s opposite, a force for exploitation and oppression. I encourage people who’re serious about changing the world to study the most advanced struggle against the capitalist system that’s in existence today, that which is being led by the Communist Party of India (Maoist). A good place to start would be by reading Arundhati Roy’s (herself not a communist..yet :) epic piece entitled “Walking with the Comrades” available online free for the searching, here is an excerpt from that piece:
"We passed the house of the Superintendent of Police (SP), which
I recognized from my last visit. He was a candid man,
the SP: “See Ma’am, frankly speaking this problem
can’t be solved by us police or military. The problem
with these tribals is they don’t understand greed. Unless
they become greedy there’s no hope for us. I have
told my boss, remove the force and instead put a TV
in every home. Everything will be automatically sorted
out.”
--
Also I will gladly answer any questions people may have about genuine socialism and communism..hell I’ll even answer your questions about phony communism too :) In the meantime if you want to learn about the glorious achievements of the revolution in China I encourage you to hear Professor Dongping Han’s BookTV talk, also online free for the searching.
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Permalink Reply by Andrew Lafont on -
Your piece is very enlightening and I thank you :)
I have been told--but now that I look back on it, it is more being 'fed'--that Communism is just a step on the path towards Socialism, that Countries are Communist and when all countries are Communist, then we can move towards Socialism.
But what I want is the world to become a single state, with out borders between countries and in countries. The various world leaders make their country Communist. Then they create a council and the council will oversee the opening of borders and that transportation is flowing. Then the council and world leaders would step down from power creating a classless society in which the people work for the betterment of all.
What type of Communist would I be? Most likely a very Idealistic one :)
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Permalink Reply by Park Bierbower on
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I think that could be referred to as a globalist. or maybe I'm just making that up.
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Permalink Reply by Andrew Lafont on
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I might be a globalist. Though one that is Idealistic.
But for those who follow Communism, who isn't Idealistic, right?
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Permalink Reply by Park Bierbower on
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I think being a globalist is idealistic in almost any sense right now in the world. don't quite understand your question, so.... yes?
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Permalink Reply by Sendero Rojo on
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There is a tremendous amount (understatement) of distortion heaped upon the communist project. The majority of people have had their education about communism as it has been filtered through the lens of the capitalist class. This is not different than going to a preacher to learn about atheism.
Communists want a world like I previously described it, and probably like the world you have envisioned as well. There has never been a communist society in well-recorded history, definitely not in the capitalist era. The only two socialist societies that have existed (USSR 1917-1956 and China 1949-1976) were far, far away from achieving communism and they’d be the first to tell you that. Communism will not be achieved in any of our lifetimes. In today’s world it is impossible to achieve communism except on a world-wide basis.
We cannot achieve communism and there still be a state, at least as we know one today. As long as there is a state that signifies that society is still divided into classes. A state is simply the means by which one class rules over others.
Someone who wants socialism in the whole world (which would be communism, or very very close to communism) is a communist (internationalist, or as the Maoist music group ¡Outernational! would say an “outernationalist” :). Someone who -->wants<-- socialism just in one country, and/or only for “your” people is a nationalist socialist, like the Nazis. There is a HUGE difference in having the goal of liberating all of humanity and just looking out for “your” people. It is the conditions that capitalism poses upon us that forces us to have the immediate goal of just seizing power in one area, but the goal is not to horde the resources in that area for just “your” people. The goals are to produce enough goods to be able to have the people in the liberated area be able to live their lives with dignity (a guaranteed right to eat, to shelter, to health care etc.. the principle of “from each according to their ability, to each according to their needs“), to be able to protect what you’ve won, and to give all of your excess to aid revolutionary movements elsewhere in the world.
You say “various world leaders make their country communist” (by that I take it that you mean socialist as it seems that you’ve got the two mixed up) and this is not a correct orientation regarding the role of leadership. You don’t become the leader of a revolutionary movement by standing at a podium, pounding your fist, yelling, and then everyone just does as you say (I tried this and it didn’t work : ). You become the leader of a revolutionary movement because the ideas that you’re putting forth express the will of the people. The role of leadership is not to make decisions on behalf of the people, but rather to best enable the people to carry out what must be done. There is always leadership (the ideas that people are led by) in some form. Here I won’t go into all of the reasons that revolutionary leadership takes the form of one person (whereas capitalist leadership comes at you from many angles), but one big reason is that when the bullets start flying, when you’ve began to really challenge the power of the capitalist dictatorship, there should be no room for confusion on what is the way forward. Confusion equals deaths, confusion equals demoralization and overall it’s stabbing the masses in the back. You need a highly organized and disciplined force in order to defeat the capitalist dictatorship, anything else, as history has shown, will just not do. If we rise up only to be crushed by the capitalist class, who will use the turbulence we’ve created and us as an example to show the masses what a “mistake” it is to try anything but capitalism again, then we best not rise up at all.
It will not be the leaders who make a country socialist. It will be the conscious act of millions of people who‘ve been enabled by leadership with proper vision to carry out what must be done. It’ll be through having a leader who knows how to properly apply the Mass Line (please let wikipedia save me from carpal tunnel here : ), not tailing the masses (which would lead right back to capitalism), but not making decisions on their behalf. If you make too many decisions on behalf of the masses, you’ll soon find that you’ll no longer be the leader of the revolutionary movement (see current situation in Nepal - also let me recommend a search at archive dot org for the documentary called Eight Glorious Years of the Great Nepalese People‘s War).
I’m glad that someone appreciates what I’ve wrote here. If you wonder why you don’t hear from more communists, well it’s about the same reason you don’t see many atheists going into a church and trying to take them all on in a debate. I need to type a small book to even begin to properly get into these matters. I’ve done a lot of work at trying to condense tons of knowledge into as few words as I can. It really helps me when I’m asked specific questions…so please more questions : )
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