Libertarianism: an abject moral and ethical failure, IMO

What do you tell a guy who is sick, goes into a coma and doesn't have health insurance? Who pays for his coverage? Are you saying society should just let him die?

That’s the question put to Representative Ron Paul (R-Texas) by Wolf Blitzer in the closing moments of Monday night’s Tea Party Express/CNN GOP Debate.

Before Paul could answer, several members of the Tea Party laden audience enthusiastically shouted out “Yeah!”

Yeah, let him die! Yeah!

Nobody in the crowd objected.

And then, right there, you got to see exactly who and what Ron Paul really is.

 

Read:  Brothers Keeper

 

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Oh, but one thing I didn't agree with was that "those people who have full coverage health care are generally healthier than those who don't have health care so it stands to reason that if everyone in the US was covered the US would be healthier." This is a false correlation. Probably the US would be healthier as a population if we all had healthcare, but not for the reason you give Becca. People who have full coverage health care are generally healthier because they are generally better off, in higher socioeconomic standing, and have far fewer of the problems which cause disease.
I like how first you disagreed with me then agreed with me by saying "Probably the US would be healthier as a population if we all had healthcare." That's what I meant in the first place.
Yes I was agreeing with you on your conclusion, but not your premise.

Typical conservative bullshit.

 

If only we made Medicare universal, we could support the health care of all US citizens without even paying any more in taxes!  We'd just have lower health insurance premiums.  Right now we are paying for useless work, for insurances to find ways to avoid paying for peoples' medical care, and to line the profits of health insurance executives.  We don't need to pay those bills.  Any of them.  If only we were to get Medicare for all.

If only. . .

 

Unfortunately, not with these rich pigs in office.

And unfortunately not with our current population who keeps voting these rich pigs into office.
Wow, amen to all 3 posts. Jason that was as forceful as I've heard the position put, nice!

What a wonderful post!

I'm having a major reaction to Chris' rather black-and-white assumption that everyone who is obese got that way because of simply overeating, when it is demonstrably not true. For example, some women have Polycystic Ovarian Syndrom (PCOS), which causes them to gain weight, develop diabetes, have hair in unwanted places, like the chin, and be infertile. It's absolutely NOT their fault, but it seems that Chris wants to penalize them anyway. People who are on corticosteroids for various reasons gain weight, again, not their fault. No one knows what the genetics and epigenetics are that cause people to gain weight -- everyone knows skinny people that can eat just as much as they want, and obese people who are trying as hard as they can, and can't lose the weight. It's truly MUCH more complex than simple overeating. So I object to Chris' blame game.

And, currently, the govt. does NOT foot the bill for chronic alcoholics for liver transplants. They have to prove they've been clean for a certain period of time (can't remember how long, but I think it's 6 months) before they will be considered (not granted, just considered!). Smokers don't get lung transplants, either. So Chris set up a straw man, and I'm knocking it down.

None of those situations affect me -- my diabetes is not obesity-related, and I am lucky enough to have good insurance coverage, not because of my virtue, but because I had a job that provides good benefits to retirees. Perceived virtue should not be the standard for receiving medical care.

"What a wonderful post!"

 

yes, it is.  I wish I could write like Jim Wright of the Stonekettle.com blog does.  Something to aspire to I suppose.

If you liked the "Brothers Keeper" post, I would encourage you to check the "greatest hits" link on stonekettle for more.

 

http://www.stonekettle.com/p/stonekettle-stations-greatest-hits.html


So true.  It is entirely possible to be overweight and completely healthy.  Obesity is the new evil since smoking on the way out.  Last month, they had and article on Yahoo news about people who lived to be over one hundred.  Guess what?  They had the same lifestyle habits as everyone else.  They drank.  They smoked.  They ate whatever they liked.  They were exactly like all their peers who died at much earlier ages.  Why?  They had genetics on their side.  A person cannot pick their genetic heritage. 

 

My grandpa and his brother both died of lung cancer.  Grandpa died at 62 and suffered terribly for months.  His brother lived to be 83 and suffered only one month.  Same parents.  Same home.  Same bad habits started about the same time.  Wait, my grandpa quit smoking 7 years before he died  and he was thinner while his chubbier brother smoked to the end, so he lived marginally healthier than his brother.  But my grandpa was poor all his life  while his brother did pretty well. 

 

Anyone can fall down on their luck.  Anyone can be in a car accident tomorrow.  Anyone can be the guy so low on the bottom he can't look up.  The law says even prisoners including the worst of the worst violent offenders get free health care.  We treat our serial murderers better than our poor. 
Wow, it makes one wonder if there are not criminals who cleverly chose their crime to get free healthcare, not to mention room, board, and food, rather than be homeless and die from exposure or hunger. Sad commentary on our society.
They do.  This man notoriously robbed a bank for one dollar because he was older, homeless, and desperately ill.  http://www.9news.com/news/sidetracks/204061/337/Man-robbed-bank-for...

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