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Permalink Reply by scott martins on March 5, 2010 at 7:00pm

I definitely wasn't talking about the god of the bible or of any religion for that matter. I was trying to make the point that since most of us came to our realization through science, and science has never actually proven that a god doesn't exist, how can we completely rule out the possibility however minute that possibility might be?

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Permalink Reply by danwest on March 5, 2010 at 7:00pm

Absolutely, undeniably, 100% sure? Maybe not that sure, but mighty close.

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Permalink Reply by Sentient Biped on March 5, 2010 at 7:03pm

This is basically a Russell's Teapot quesiton.

The wikipedia discussion is pretty much what I would say, but I can't say it that well.

In addition, the questions presupposes that if there are gods, there is only one; and presupposes that we are all talking about the same one. I am as sure there is no Yawheh as I am there is no Thor, Zeus, Prometheus, Quetzalcoatl, or Ahura Mazdā. Or orbiting teapot.

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Permalink Reply by danwest on March 5, 2010 at 7:12pm

"...since most of us came to our realization through science..." Might be interesting hear how everyone would respond to this. Science contributed to, but was not completely responsible for, my escape from religious indoctrination.

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Permalink Reply by Trance Gemini on September 24, 2011 at 10:34am

Good point. I was never indoctrinated so I was atheist long before science ever came into the picture. In addition, I remained an atheist because I have never come across any reason to change and never found any religious belief that made sense and didn't have followers who weren't complete hypocrites. Science had little, if anything to do with it.

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Permalink Reply by TNT666 on September 24, 2011 at 10:51am

Indeed, I was also raised without the religious/godly BS, and similarly, never saw any religion that made any sense at all. My family was very in tune with nature, gardening, farming, and the outdoors. I made my decision to go into the sciences later, at the age of 15.

I do meet many many atheists who make a whole bunch of erroneous scientific claims who pretend they're scientists though! :)

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Permalink Reply by mojo5501 on March 5, 2010 at 7:12pm

Since gods are "super-natural" I don't think scientists have the tools to study them...scientists can study religion, religious customs, religious beliefs, etc, etc, etc. God's existence is a philosophical question in my opinion and not the realm of scientific inquiry. I am 99.9999 % confident that there is no supernatural being that is watching over me, protecting me, punishing me, having strong fatherlike paternal feelings for me...etc etc. And Jesus as the son of God takes us to a whole other realm of illogical thinking....but I'm willing to say that there is a 1% chance that God is possible...but unlikely. If I were the gambling type, I'd trust myself with this bet of probability.

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Permalink Reply by Craigart14 on October 15, 2011 at 12:10pm

Since there is no supernatural, there are no gods.

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Permalink Reply by Atheist Exile on March 5, 2010 at 7:37pm

Hi Scott,

I think that 99% is reasonable for a deist God but 99.9999% is reasonable for a theist God.

Given how much we don't know, certainty must contain some element of dogma. The 2 reigning paradigms of physics -- relativity and quantum mechanics -- are at loggerheads with each other. We have fundamental gaps in our understanding. Total certainty is far from reasonable.

The 2 greatest reservations I have holding me back from 100% certainty centers around (1) the origin of the universe and (2) the ineffable mystery of life.

I had held that (1) if the universe had a beginning, that would violate the fundamental laws of nature and open the door to a supernatural "source". But the latest scientific consensus asserts that the universe sprang naturally from nothing because the total energy of the universe equals zero (thanks to negative energy). Nature abhors a void and fills it with quantum fluctuations. If that's true, then I guess my reservation #1 has been removed.

Thus far, (2) abiogenesis is an unsubstantiated theory. We don't know how animate beings sprang from inanimate matter. The fact that there should be life (or universe) at all is awe-inspiring to me. Given the billions of years that must have preceded life in the universe, its appearance is the closest thing I know of to a miracle. Given the scales of time and space involved, it's not unreasonable to believe that life was inevitable and that it simply had to wait for the right conditions. The "anthropic coincidences" of cosmology and physics suggests a universe fine-tuned for life and gives me pause to wonder if the conditions for life were truly inevitable on physical grounds.

The bottom line, to me, is that the question of The Creator is irrelevant to us. He's surely not a personal God.

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Permalink Reply by joseph f logston on March 5, 2010 at 8:15pm

hi ft i think that intelligence haves to be evolve, it is a long process thats the same with life its a vary long process. we can in a lab grow mole out of nothing that mite be the start of making life, it will be found out how to make life, that dont make us g?ds, the mono-g?d is out of all questions,.. it dose not exist............... im a 100%............thanks for your post its a good one

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Permalink Reply by Sonny Mobley on March 5, 2010 at 8:32pm

Right on, man.

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Permalink Reply by Sonny Mobley on March 5, 2010 at 8:32pm

99.9% which is so close to 100% that the difference is moot as far as all practical concerns go.

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