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In dealing with Christians on climate.

The vast majority of those who deny climate change are Americans... religious Americans.
Notably so in the Evangelical sects of the US.

The issue is how to deal with them, their careless treatment of the planet, it's resources, etc.

I've found the following logic to work on occasion.
I've summarised it into a "passage" for easier reading. It also makes more sense to the religious in this form... for some reason.

(I don't believe in god... but the only thing that makes sense to these people is god and what their imaginary friend may or may not want... so I had to use that angle.)

"Did god not make trees flammable?
The waters taintable?
Why then do you believe his largest and greatest creation of all was not created equally as fragile?
Your life is a test. And this planet, gods house and greatest creation, is a part of that test.

Hell itself cannot enforce the level of fury god will show you when he sees what YOU have willingly done to his house... while arrogantly claiming you've done nothing."

Of course, feel free to throw up a little upon reading the "god" parts... I threw up a little writing them... unfortunately, I can't effectively deliver the message to them with "Who doesn't exist" tacked on to every sentence.
... they tend to catch on to you being Atheist that way.

Tags: atheism, atheist, christian, climate, gift, global, gods, greatest, science

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Permalink Reply by Clare Fassio on June 20, 2010 at 1:52am

It seems like you are categorizing me as a climate denier as opposed to a climate skeptic. There is fantastic research out there which has put a better perspective on what's happening, but it is a thoroughly complex issue and there are still a lot of questions to be answered. This is why I'm still a skeptic. This doesn't mean that several months or years from now I won't be sure of anthropogenic global warming impact on our world.

I checked out the link you gave me, and there is loads of information on a variety of subjects. I think you should point me to where want me to go--it might take me a while to find it! lol

I just wanted to point out that not all people who aren't 100% convinced of AGW are religious. The outright deniers of global warming are the Republicans--who also happen to be the more religious political party as well. Republicans have strong ties in oil, and they are basing their denial on their own self interests and not on scientific data. No wonder people who watch Fox News think global warming is some liberal conspiracy--oil czars in the middle east own good portions of Fox. But tell that to a denier (and I have. All this guy watches is Fox News! *shutters*) and they'll say it's mere coincidence.

Also, there's a great article on climate skeptics vs climate deniers in the new issue of Skeptic magazine. You should read it if you can!

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Permalink Reply by nick altman on June 21, 2010 at 9:35am

I don't think you're a denier. I was skeptical myself, considering this concept could possibly be due to natural climate shift and we're making a mistake by viewing the situation through anthropomorphic tinted glasses. It's easy to see how it could be an issue of misplaced guilt over the irresponsible use of natural resources in the past 200 years, and the drastic effect our species has had on the other species of Earth. My generation, growing up in the 80s and 90s, was almost religiously indoctrinated into the idea of environmentalism, so a little cynicism towards it is to be expected.

I myself was skeptical, as I said, on the fence about it. I finally had the arguments and evidence laid out in a way that made things fairly clear to me, on the JREF forums, and just thought I'd share it with you, as a fellow fence sitter. It's a fantastic site, with lots and lots of interesting topics.
I'm not saying you're wrong, and here's a link to prove it. I just wanted to share with you this resource, as you seem to be a reasonable person.

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Permalink Reply by Clare Fassio on June 21, 2010 at 12:21pm

I''m very grateful for the link! I can't wait to go through it when I have the time. Where's the global warming thread you want me to read? I can't seem to find it

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Permalink Reply by Jason Spicer on June 21, 2010 at 12:57pm

I think nick's link just takes you to the top of the forums. I couldn't find what he was referring to either. As an alternative, you might try here or here for lists of skeptical arguments and why they don't wash.

The bottom line is that humans have been pumping enormous amounts of CO2 into the atmosphere for the last couple centuries, above what the planet can absorb. CO2 is an insulator. How could the planet fail to warm? I have yet to see skeptics propose a mechanism by which you can add insulation and not heat things up.

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Permalink Reply by Clare Fassio on June 19, 2010 at 11:18pm

Oh, I saw the most hilarious bumper sticker today!

"WHAT HAVE FUTURE GENERATIONS EVER DONE FOR US?"

LOL

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Permalink Reply by Secular Forces 2013 on June 20, 2010 at 4:21pm

Ya lost me on dealing with 'C'hristians...
seems they gotta deal with the modern world, manipulate it, exploit the people and make legion with other fundamentalist religions for the good of their McMansions or sect hide-outs to rape their choice of human...
hugh!?!?

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Permalink Reply by LarryL on June 27, 2010 at 9:14pm

Perhaps the "end result" of climate change will be the "Armageddon" that the xtians keep saying is coming. Perhaps they were right afterall!

Really, maybe worldwide starvation/flooding/migrations will be a good thing in that it will get the world population down to a more sustainable level - while us smart atheists are hanging out in the mountains.

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Permalink Reply by Jo Jerome on July 4, 2010 at 11:39am

Perhaps the "end result" of climate change will be the "Armageddon" that the xtians keep saying is coming.

Not too far off. There are Xian groups seeking to hasten the 'end times.' Many more who genuinely believe it will happen in their lifetimes, are looking forward to it, and thus might have unconscious motivation to hasten it. Or at the very least, have the attitude "Why take care of the Earth? Jesus is coming next week to take us all away anyhow."

Of course, I've tried to use that rational that they should stop voting and worrying about who is president. Shockingly, their faith isn't that strong.

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Permalink Reply by Yusuf Said on January 9, 2011 at 9:51am

It's sad that you need to talk to religious people like they're children for them to understand any concepts. I feel like Im talking to a dog or small child when I have to explain something to a theist. They're so thick-headed.