How would you respond

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Permalink Reply by Pat on April 5, 2012 at 8:42pm

Here's my humble response.

"I'd rather have someone with Christian religious values as POTUS than a Muslim or an atheist. Everyone's always afraid of a religious politician, but history in this country has shown it to be a non-issue once in office." 

Really! Then I guess you would have voted against Thomas Jefferson, who said, "History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes." Letter to Alexander von Humboldt.

And for that matter, you would have opposed James Madison, author of the Bill of Rights which grants religious freedom in this country, who said this about chaplains in Congress. "Is the appointment of Chaplains to the two Houses of Congress consistent with the Constitution, and with the pure principle of religious freedom?  In strictness the answer on both points must be in the negative. The establishment of the chaplainship to Congs is a palpable violation of equal rights, as well as of Constitutional principles."

Or, Thomas Paine, one of the founding fathers and author of 'Common Sense," "The American Crisis," and "The Rights of Man." "All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit." 

But, then again, what the hell did the founding fathers know about creating a nation not based on religion?

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Permalink Reply by annet on April 5, 2012 at 11:10pm

Pat's answer is on point.  Going to go watch the video Don posted, sounds good!

Here are a few one liners in case your Santorumite is unable to process that much information at one time.  (too much amygdala not enough cortex) 

I am offended by RS condemning 1/4 of Americans to "hell"

I am offended by RS using white supremacy as a campaign theme

I am offended by RS denying women rights that his wife had, like shacking up with an abortion doctor.

I would rather have an atheist because I'd be able to see the data behind their decisions and not have to wonder if Jesus is going to appear on toast and tell them to nuke someone.

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Permalink Reply by Joshua Francom on April 6, 2012 at 2:51am

While it is true that Rick Santorum is as religiously bigoted as they come I think it is important to note that he won't actually have that much power to make legislation. That's what the other branches of government  are for, making sure that you save the population from a tyrannical leader head. 

I think that if you wanted to make an effective point about Rick Santorum you should mention his character in reference to what he believes. What a person believes shows who they are and what they care about. So even if you agree with his economic issues (which I don't) you should still look at his social issues (which are obviously terrible) and judge him on how little you like them. Because if he shows himself to be morally wrong in one area then it brings him down as a whole. 

I wouldn't use the argument that he is similar or that his views parallel a Muslim extremist. While it is very much true, it's simply not a convincing argument for a theist. You should be able to show him quotes about how his morals are wrong and he believes in things more extremist than they are. And if they fully agree on these things then why are you talking to these people? you are not going to get across to them because their morals/lives/identities are based on the bible, if you attack biblical morals then you are attacking them personally. It's like you are just calling their mother a whore. It's all they are going to hear.

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Permalink Reply by Nontheist Central on April 6, 2012 at 9:39pm

This is a reply from someone with a very one-sided view, obviously.  If most people who think atheists are horrible people would actually spend some time talking to any of us, they might have a different view.  RECENT history shows that it is DEFINITELY an issue because bigoted legislation is being passed that has no basis other than religious.  Legislation is being passed that forbids abortion regardless of rape, incest or mental health of the mother involved in an unwanted pregnancy.  These unwanted children are at a much higher risk of being abused because they were born UNWANTED!  Loving people are kept from adopting children based on the fact that they're gay and nothing more.  These same people aren't allowed to get married.  Of course, if you asked Michelle Bachman, she'd try to tell you that IS equal rights because any of those gay men are welcome to marry any woman they want, who want to marry them, just like everyone else.  *facepalm*

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Permalink Reply by Rebel on April 7, 2012 at 9:09am

thanks everyone....I basically said that i worry about someone who has to use a bronze age writing as their moral compass....and always has a fall back of "not my fault....god made me do it"....and an atheist would always be stuck with taking full responsibility for their own actions and would therefore make a more well thought out choice.  I also worked annet's statement about jesus appearing on a piece of toast....he didn't like that too much but oh well....maybe he will pray I am forgiven......

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