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Permalink Reply by Caperton Miller on March 18, 2010 at 10:41pm

Even though I'm an atheist I'm gonna' pick D. Seriously! Allow me to explain. I do believe someone related to the character in the Bible existed. And I believe this cult leader of sorts really had following. And I believe HIS claims are true. That you should turn the other cheek, that you should love your enemy etc. Of course the walk on water, heal the blind stuff is all horse shit. But I think some of the things he talked about made sense. (Okay, I guess I'm really an A or a B, but what the heck. I guess I'm a contrarian before I'm an Atheist. So sue me!!)

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Permalink Reply by Arnold on March 19, 2010 at 3:03pm

I'm probably somewhere between B & C. Most of the reputable scholarship I've read concludes there was an itinerant preacher in the early 1st century CE known as Jesus of Nazareth who was crucified around 30 CE. Little else is known about him and most if not all of the biographical information contained in the NT is fictional. My only reservation is that some sources claim Nazareth was uninhabited during the time that Jesus is supposed to have lived, though there are plenty of sources that argue it was inhabited at that time.
It seems plausible to me that Jesus may have been a composite character based on several supposed messiahs of the period -- there were literally dozens. Acts 18.24-28 suggests that, within 20 years of his death, the facts of Jesus' life and ministry were disputed to the point that some of his followers were unaware of a distinctly christian baptism.
The name Jesus is taken from the Greek Iesous, which is equivalent to the Aramaic Yeshua, or Joshua. Joshua was the successor to Moses in the Exodus/Conquest of Canaan stories. Jesus' parents were also named for heroes of ancient Israel: Joseph and Miriam. They may well have been literary devices. The fact that there is no Tomb of Joseph of Nazareth and early Xians claimed that his mother's body was whisked away to heaven upon her death further supports the assumption that no one knew their real names.
Conclusion: there may have been a Jesus of Nazareth -- some person or persons created enough of a stir that, by the middle of the 1st century CE, many people believed there had been such a person who was the greatest thing since Moses. I doubt we'll ever know for sure.

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Permalink Reply by Graeme on March 20, 2010 at 10:27pm

A. Believed he existed, claims are false

If he was fictional the gospel writers wouldn't have tried to put a square peg in a round hole so he could fit prophecies. The contortions are ridiculous. Riding into town on a donkey and a horse for example.

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Permalink Reply by Arnold on March 20, 2010 at 10:43pm

The prophecies they were trying to fulfill would likely be the same either way. One of the gospel writers happened to interpret a donkey & the foal of a donkey as two animals rather than parallel references to one animal.

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Permalink Reply by Graeme on March 20, 2010 at 10:54pm

To be honest Arnold I've never been religious nor have I read the bible, I'm just going on stories I've heard from various sources.

What about their attempt to have him born in a different town than he was or trying to make his father the descendant of a king (David I think). Do you see those as attempts to fit prophecy or are there other explanations?

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Permalink Reply by Arnold on March 21, 2010 at 11:22am

Definitely making him fit prophecy. The whole census thing is fictional. Augustus never ordered a world census and the regional Syrian census ordered by Quirinius was about 10 years after the death of Herod the Great. I've suggested before that there were probably more descendants of King David than not in Judea by the 1st century CE, if David had half as many wives as the stories say. So they wanted to make him a special "son of David."

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Permalink Reply by AYALA on March 21, 2010 at 12:20am

I know many Jesi (plural of Jesus??) in my neighborhood here in Chicago, so yes, they exist. I met a few in the ward of the psychiatric hospital I worked in. They all claimed to have been the original one, son of the virgin. However, each one whispered in my ear that the others are: shh...impostors.
....Well, What's important is the powerful Jesus myth and the way it has been shaping Western Culture. So yes, the myth exists and strives!!!

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Permalink Reply by John on March 21, 2010 at 9:34am

There are a number of books out that point to the non existence of Jesus of the bible. One you might like is the Jesus puzzle.

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Permalink Reply by Arnold on March 21, 2010 at 11:00am

In the end it doesn't matter. Even if the name was taken from a real person, the Jesus of the NT bears little or no resemblance to any particular individual. Someone mentioned Macbeth in another post -- Macbeth was a real person, but not the character in Shakespeare's play. My point is, let the apologists have a historical Jesus & the problem of the mythical character remains.

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Permalink Reply by John on March 21, 2010 at 1:08pm

Well I am thiking if I do not believe in a god or gods why concern myself about Jesus. I hope this does not end the discussion.

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Permalink Reply by Cat on March 25, 2010 at 11:58pm

C - There is not evidence of his ever existing, the amount of energy that has gone into TRYING to prove it. Proves to me he never did and sure as hell didn't die and come back!

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Permalink Reply by LeeLah on March 27, 2010 at 6:45pm

E. A conglomerate of all the oral traditions that came before.

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