this guy seems to think so. he says it's "hate speech", although i'm sure he thinks it's perfectly acceptable to speak vulgarities of non heterosexuals so long as they come from the mouth of a bearded duck hunter. i also wonder what people who criticize atheist billboards think of the ones that tell me i'm going to hell, but i digress.

what is really going on here is these folks feel threatened. for the first time in their lives religious voices aren't the only ones that people hear. atheists are challenging the monopoly on messaging. there obviously isn't anything hateful in suggesting that people don't NEED christ during the holiday season. if you want him you can have him, but others get comfort from seeing that they aren't alone in their disbelief.  in that regard it's the exact opposite of hateful - it's a kindness.  

here we get to the heart of Christian Persecution Syndrome.  when he says "religious persecution of the kind that similarly led to the Holocaust..." we should know to stop listening.  no one, not one single Christian in America, is being persecuted.  it makes you wonder if he (or they) even know what persecution means.  obviously, since Godwin's Law has been violated, no one will take this guy seriously.  still, the fact that he's able to compare a message about atheism to the killing of millions of Jews without major public backlash shows that we've got a long way to go.  

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Actually, you CAN believe what you want ... and attempting to legislate otherwise amounts to legislating against thought-crime, which religion already does with the 10th commandment.

HOWEVER ... ACTING on an unsubstantiated belief is a WHOLE 'nother matter!

I was thinking the same thing Loren.  You cannot stop someone from thinking something.  I mean, I wish people didn't think horrible things, but it's probably not happening. People have the right to be as dumb as they want to be.

And, of course, you're right about acting on that dumbness...

I would never propose legislating against thought. I do feel there is a place to publicly discuss the idea of responsible thought. As individuals, and as a society, we should discuss what constitutes responsible action, speech and thought. Isn't your Atheism an attempt to achieve responsible thought?

Don't you agree there is always a corresponding relationship between freedom and responsibility? I don't like the idea of telling anyone it's okay to believe anything you want. Letting people indulge in absurd reasoning will have bad consequences for them and people they are in contact with.

Supporting responsible thought should not be seen as an attempt to establish thought police; it should be seen as advice to achieve greater awareness and freedom.

This is on the level with that jackass congressional candidate, Ian Bayne from Illinois who says the patriarch from Duck Dynasty is like Rosa Parks in his courage. I just don't know how we can measure the stupid. As my son says. It burns it burns.

Great.  Another reason to be proud to be from Illinois.  Ugh!

What's more likely to lead to a holocaust is the evangelical christian over-the-top propaganda and evangelizing their hatred, demonizing, and scapegoating.  They continue inside the US, and export their hatred with missionary zeal to despots around the world -


Russia now imprisons people who say anything progay - calling it "propaganda' - something American evangelist and hate monger Scott Lively takes credit for, paid by american christians.  The antigay propaganda in Russia is reaching a fever pitch - actor and former Russian Orthodox priest Ivan Okhlobystin, who stars in the country's version of hit medical comedy "Scrubs," says children...need to be protected from "sodomites....  Calling for gays to be burned alive in ovens.  Literally.

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Uganda now has new law, promoted by American evangelists, that requires life imprisonment of LGBT people, and prison terms for people who don't turn in their LGBT neighbors or family members to police.  The bill targets gays "with brutal persecution and is one of the worst human rights violations of our time," said Ross Murray, director of news for the American activist group, GLAAD. Murray said U.S. evangelical preachers and groups "created this travesty of justice, and it is now up to fair-minded Americans to speak out for the very lives of LGBT people in Uganda."  Again, Scott Lively is prominent, but again, paid by American christian groups, and other "leaders" are involved.

"Since the implementation of the anti-LGBT law in Russia, violence against LGBT people appears to have increased and includes incidents in which neo-Nazis use social media websites to lure young gay men to torture and beatings"


These are real lives, real people who are or will be persecuted, directly as a result of American christian-supported politicians and laws.

make no mistake, they want to bring it here too.  note Pat Buchanan praising Putin and admonishing "Barack Obama's America" for being the new evil.  

Oh absolutely.  Scott Lively has a hopefully ill-fated campaign as governor of Massachussets.   NOM remains active, supported mainly by the catholic church, knights of  columbus, and a handful of rich catholics.  The various dishonestly-named family associations are also active and continuously propagandize their demonization.

Just when I think the world can't get any sicker...  I can't even handle that.

Let me see if I have this correct her, Daniel. I watched your vids of Lively talking about gays, and he says homosexuals are the reason we have porn here in America. Apparently a bunch of homosexual men wanted us all to be able to watch and read about heretrosexual sex acts. I suppose they are softening us all up before they throw in the homosexual videos. Then we are to believe they are having a "war" with us because of some biblical reference to "powers and principalities." (The fundies use this one when they bring demons into the picture.) Is this man aware that he is making everything sound so frightening that people could end up getting killed here, and it's his bullshit that agged it on?

Scott Lively and others like him deserve to lose elections. They do not deserve to be in office of any kind. This type of movement is sort of like the blind being led by the insane!

Dennis Lively has been spreading hate for decades.  He claims the Nazis were a gay conspiracy and were the guiding force behind the holocaust.   His hatred is so deep, I think he would like it if gays were killed as a result of his words.


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