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Am I Mistaken or Does the Military Despise Obama?

It seems to me on my other website (CafeMom) that the military despises him.
They think that we shouldn't leave Iraq; we had every right to invade and we have done the Iraqi people a big favor. Oh, and yes the Iraqi people adore us. And there's so much more going on that the American people don't know about.
And Obama's gonna cut out their pensions and wages and medical.
Is there an indoctrination process that causes these people to believe this stuff?
Is there a different perspective over here?

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Permalink Reply by Gecko, Seth...brother of Richie! on April 26, 2009 at 1:07am

9 years as a Marine and two years as a full timer in the National Guard. No the military does not hate Obama. Yes the officer corps is or was mostly Republican, the enlisted ranks (Im A SGT>) are pretty much like the rest of America. There is no I repeat NO political indoctrination in the US military. Any one who attempted such a thing would be skinned!
Most who join the service for long periods of time tend to be conservative. Liberals dont do as well with the whole killing thing. At least modern day liberals, many of the great great liberal thinkers of the twentieth century came out of the front lines of WWII. Conservatives tend to forget this. Latter day liberals came out of Vietnam. Whole different ball game there are times to go to war and times to not fight. Iraq was the wrong war carried out by inexperienced politicos. The focus was shifted from Afghanistan and guess what we are building back up there and we are going to leave a destabilized Iraq in our wake.
But there is a bigger screw up here at the heart of whole matter, and that is the abandoning of Afghanistan in 1990 when the Soviets were defeated. A vacuum allowed the most insane of the Islamics to take control. The entire world stood by and watched, same in Rwanda, and now Darfur. The UN has once again shown its moral deficiency with allowing this ridiculous conference on racism to be led and controlled by the most racist and hateful countries on our planet. And those are Islamic countries.
One other point if behind closed doors (perhaps they are cracked open a bit) those in the service have such incredible disdain for liberals lets not forget to look at some of the most vocal, and media savvy.
Sean Penn, gives the impression of a good liberal who runs into the arms of the nearest dictator to criticize the (then ) US administration. Danny Glover, Oliver Stone(one of my favorite directors) and others who flocked to Hugo Chavez, Penn also went to Iraq. Guess he was never shown the rape rooms.
I must believe but do not have statistical proof, that most liberals in this country today are not that gullible. If Im wrong than Im truly alone, because I broke all ties with the conservative movement a while ago. Just because we disagree with a president, that person will be out of office in given time period and we have the opportunity to effect change, hence Obama, it is no excuse to turn with batted eyes to some of the most megamaniacal people on the planet. Bush was arrogant, and ignorant. He was wrong and he is gone, Chavez, the dictator of Darfur, Castro's brother, Saudi royal family, these people will not be gone with out violence. sorry.

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Permalink Reply by Jo Jerome on April 27, 2009 at 9:07am

Just had an interesting encounter that opens even this cynic's eyes a lot wider to the indoctrination theory.

Talking with my new motorcycle mechanic over the weekend. Raised Jewish in a highly Christian environment but appears currently Agnostic at best for many of the reasons that we are Atheists - irrationality of the bible, irrationality and inconsistency of gods in general, etc. Seems to be a very level-headed, reason-oriented guy.

Then in conversation he says that, "We servicemen are still really iffy about Obama. We've spent the last 7 years fighting Muslims and now we have a Muslim president."

-_-

My gut was to go into the general response of "Where to begin?!? On what evidence?!? The random email your grandma sent you?!?" But I didn't.

Here is a guy who has spent nearly 20 years in the Army straight out of high school. I'm not saying by any means that all military men and women are brainwashed automatons, but that is kinda/sorta the goal of the military. One mind. Group think. This is your enemy. No questions asked.

So when their commander-in-chief for the last 8 years - and subsequently lots of commanders under him - spends those years telling our military that they are at war with Islam, is it any surprise that a fair number follow that order like the good soldiers they've been trained to do? And is it any wonder just how easy it is to convince someone, "Look; Obama has a Muslim name - he must be a Muslim, right?"

I'm very much in favor of at least a 2-party system to keep the checks and balances. But if this is the face of Republicanism, I really don't mind one entity being in control for a while to smooth that out a bit.

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Permalink Reply by Gecko, Seth...brother of Richie! on April 27, 2009 at 9:36am

The guys an idiot, I cancel him out, bring 10 more and Ill bring 10 more to cancel them out. I havent met a soldier yet who thinks Obama is a Muslim. And Im around them almost every day.
War is a term that can mean many things ( unfortunately) , to some degree Im at war with Islam, Im at war with Christianity, Hinduism, Buddhism, paganism, I was kidnapped by alien ism..on and on.
I am not a non-theist, I am a anti-theist. I have an agenda. As far as that term war, we are at war in the violent sense against the extreme elements of Islam which is most of Islam sorry this was not a hijacked religion, they are practicing whats written. Christianity and Jud ism were hijacked (thankful;ly) by western philosophy and progress. The military taught me very little of this, because there is no indoctrination. The Marine Corps alone has a religion its called the Marine Corps!!

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Permalink Reply by Jo Jerome on April 27, 2009 at 8:09pm

SGecko - Perhaps because this guy is in the Army, which if I understand correctly is a whole different animal than the Marines? ;-)

But yeah, I get the feeling that overall, Obama's policies are more cheered than booed by those currently serving. For one thing, I would think there's a few of y'all nodding your heads in agreement that if we're to go after someone, perhaps it should be, I don't know, just maybe, the people who were actually involved with 9/11?

Still, listening to this man and others like him I can't help but be absolutely amazed that this country as a whole overcame so much ignorance and bigotry to elect Obama anyway. Most candidates only have to win us over on policy. Obama had to do that as well as muck through the bigotry.

It'll be interesting to see how the next few years play out...

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Permalink Reply by Gecko, Seth...brother of Richie! on April 27, 2009 at 8:34pm

Im very stoked about the future. Obama will have some missteps but I dont thimk they will be to the degree of the Bush administration. You know Obama will be a better decider!
Yes the Army and the Marines have alot of differences, but I think what you encountered was a person who entered the military with conservative, and or ignorant convictions to begin with thats usually what happens you run what you brung!

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Permalink Reply by Mike Hein on August 14, 2009 at 10:35pm

"Soldiers are trained to dehumanize the enemy, not question orders, and kill without remorse"

John, that's a rather immense generalization and pretty much inaccurate. Soldiers are trained. They are trained for many things. It doesn't matter what branch (answering Mary Wood), it doesn't matter what era or political climate. Today, that climate is 'democrat' or 'liberal'. Soldiers will still be trained. They will take that training into harm's way, onto battlefields, into situations where they are sometimes occupiers/conquerors and sometimes liberators...all within a couple of blocks.

While the current current flows liberal and the power structure in the US military is conservative, let us all please not make assumptions about what soldiers think, what they do, or what they care about unless you have some direct experiece with soldiers.

They are soldiers. "For references please consult the entirety of human history"
Regards,

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Permalink Reply by Mike Hein on August 17, 2009 at 11:27am

No, John, I didn't think you were slamming US soldiers, I just felt I had some thoughts that figured into the discussion. Cheers.

EDIT: And my apologies for the shitty tone of my post. That snuck in accidentally.

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Permalink Reply by Jezzy on August 23, 2009 at 3:26pm

Keep in mind that people in the military are ... people in the military. If you join the military in the first place, you probably believe in the cause.

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Permalink Reply by Claire Greene on August 23, 2009 at 4:29pm

Well, I just wanted to post a quick (or not) comment. As a child of a retired Navy guy, a former Army NG woman and a wife of 13 years to an active duty Navy guy, I have quite a bit of first hand knowledge.

First, I wanted to agree with Mike Hein about the training - we are trained to do many things and yes, killing someone is one of those things. But we were also taught compassion, diplomacy, etc. No one WANTS to get killed. And once the bullets start flying, there now is only one path - kill or be killed. So it makes sense to try other methods first that might keep your butt alive and allow you to go back home.

Second, the idea that you join the military because you believe in a cause is true, but I question the whole idea of "the" cause. What one would that be? Bush politics? Because most people I know in the military ARE united about one cause - but the one cause is that America is a great country and one worth defending. How we go about defending it is certainly not unanimous! I know many conservatives in the military, but I know tons of liberals, homosexuals (which, by the way, often everyone knows about but don't care), etc. Remember, the huge majority of people in the military are under 21, which often means they are not nearly as right wing as the older (and public faces) of the military.
Third, the idea that two parties (who have both failed spectacularly at running this country at various times) is enough to represent the american people is ludicrous. Many conservatives are furious about the party being highjacked by religious nuts. And many liberals are furious at the party being highjacked by socialist p.c. nuts. With the complex problems of the world, who really thinks that only two solutions are the right answer??
Finally, the military is just as mixed on their views of Obama as the rest of America. Many of us hated Bush. Many of us loved him. Many of us had mixed feelings about what he did - approved of some things and despised others. Same thing for Obama. Some of us really don't like him, but the idea that we all hate Obama as a knee jerk reaction or indoctrination is insulting. Isn't your comment just as knee jerk and reactionary? There are some of us who don't like him for very intelligent reasons and some who love him for other intelligent reasons! Please don't make any blanket statements about the military when there are about a million of us - all with different backgrounds, races, religions, politics, etc.

Thanks for listening to my rant!

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Permalink Reply by Chris Z on August 29, 2009 at 1:31am

Well argued and reasoned point.

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Permalink Reply by Chris Z on August 27, 2009 at 1:14pm

If I may try to address your question. I am an Atheist, a Conservative, Pro-life, a Veteran, a Vegetarian, and a Physics Student. I served in Iraq awhile ago. I don't despise President Obama; however, I do hope his policies fail. The sooner the better. Keynsian Economic, Wealth Redistribution, and Egalitarinaism will bring us down. Austrian Economics, Capitalism, and Equal Opportunity will bring us back on track.