9/11, nutjobs, selective blog editing and Clarence

This has reached a point of ludicrousness that is on par with the worst nutjobs I have ever encountered. However, it is not something I feel can be ignored nor dismissed as a troll, because it is disseminating bad, even harmful, information; dressing it up with fraudulent academic credibility; and now slandering individuals that could be identified.

I am all for the right of lunatics to speak freely. I will even fight for that right, even if it is not in my best interests. But I am not for the right of lunatics to freely spout bullshit, and then silence any kind of dissent to their lunacy. And where lunatics stop being amusing is when they start accusing identifiable individuals of being accessories to conspiracy to murder, as in the case of accusing former employees of the Ace Elevator company of smuggling a 100 tonnes of "nano-thermite" into the WTC and painting the buildings core load bearing structure with it prior to the buildings being brought down by hijacked planes [*].

Now most of us enjoy the odd lunatic a la David Mabus / Dennis Markuze, where everyone gathers around, pokes him/her with some sticks, has a laugh and moves on. That's OK, we know they are lunatics, there is no ambiguity. The situation is markedly different when it is one of our own, and the lunacy they spout does stand a chance of being taken seriously by the less critical amongst us. There is also the serious issue of what does it do to AtheistNexus' credibility as it is seen by the outside world ? I certainly do not want to be associated with these kinds of voodoo merchants, nor would I want anything to do with a site that encourages them.

You will not be allowed further opportunities to cast dispersions on my dime, Mister. -- Alex Donovan being told in Clarence-speak his commentary is now prohibited

The original thread is here -


Due to the the thread being edited selectively, and the possibility of it being deleted permanently as well, I have archived what could be saved in the attached - 20090605_clarence_911.zip

I am posting it here because clarence can't manipulate it here, and it also won't fall off the topic list as quickly as from the front page - where he insisted on splattering it in the first place. Relevant issues are collated below, gathered from the discussions. The whole thread needs to be read to be believed.

[*] - For people having trouble visualising this feat, this is a typical 200 litre drum next to an average sized person -

That means ~ 500 of these were moved into the buildings occupied by ~50,000 workers, the contents liberally smeared all over the place, and nobody noticed. Oddly enough, for all the bizarre details that 911 conspiracists nitpick over of stuff found in the rubble, incinerated shells of chemical drums are never once mentioned.

These people (in the 9/11 truth movement) use the "reverse scientific method"… they determine what happened, throw out all the data that doesn't fit their conclusion, and then hail their findings as the only possible conclusion. -- Thomas W. Eagar

Tags: 911, and, bullshit, conspiracy, disinformation, fear, fnord, loathing, misinformation, nutjobs, More…oil, snake, witchdoctors

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Felch - I'd been ignoring this OP on the main page and recent activity side bar because, well, it smacked of conspiracy nut. The same way I don't buy into unicorns and Allah's mercy, I don't buy into UFO landings and 911 "Truthers".

So I hadn't realized real people had been named. Thanks for exposing the risks of that move, and hopefully this subject dies down. I'm proud of being a freethinker, and of finally belonging to a group I can mostly respect. Crap like this just makes me look as crazy as I did in my fundie days.
Again, Thank You Felch! For exposing this kind of...

I am not able to be nice about conspiracy theorists and their tactics, so I will leave it at that.

Speaking for myself only; I don't want to be associated with anyone that encourages this crap either and I think, by you exposing them for what they are to the community, the community will see the BS and shun them as well.

I know loons are better off ignored, but this has transgressed all acceptable boundaries. For the benefit of everyone, I just wanted to compile ALL of the information about this deranged babbling so that when the search engine bots call, we have a resource that clearly shows it is not representative of us or of this site. It is a colossal embarrassment.


How do you get thermite out of your underpants ?


Fly a plane into a building.
More insanity on A/N making us look nutty. (Or maybe just him... http://atheistnexus.org/forum/topics/just-seeing-if-i-fit-in-here?x...)
Two more articles I've found just now, one with a tinfoil hat and one without, one attacking the other. What's interesting is comparing the language used in the articles. I could almost smell the sulfurous hellfire from the preaching in one of them. I'll let you folks decide which one for yourselves. This is mostly for the next nutjob that wants to whip up hysteria about this here - seems to happen every 6 months. And if anyone knows who the hell Michael Green is, I'd like to know. Non-911 pages on him don't exist.

Was it Nanotech-Thermite or Phasers that took down the WTC?

Pardon Our Dust, or, Why the World Trade Center Dust Matters

Succinct evaluation of the circus -

Until new investigations are opened up, and secret intelligence reports are released to the public, the conspiracy theories will have a life of their own, and will be self perpetuating. The controversy will never cease. But it is clear to me that if the people who don’t believe the official story are willing to accept very poor quality data at face value, without scrutiny, then they are hurting their cause of getting to the bottom of what really happened. Progressives hate it when conservatives use suspect data to support ideas like the denial of global warming, or the “safety” of genetically modified foods. But when it comes to their own pet theories, progressives often turn procrustean, accepting any suspect information because it fits with their preconceived notions.
Positively thigh slapping. More on those esteemed publishers that brought you the thermite paper -

Spoof paper accepted by 'peer-reviewed' journal

At New Scientist we love a good hoax, especially one that both amuses and makes a serious point about the communication of science. So kudos to Philip Davis, a graduate student in library and information science at Cornell University in Ithaca, New York, who revealed yesterday on The Scholarly Kitchen blog that he got a nonsensical computer-generated paper accepted for publication in a supposedly peer-reviewed journal.

Earlier this year, Davis started receiving unsolicited emails from Bentham Science Publishers, which publishes more than 200 "open-access" journals – which turn the conventional business model of academic publishing on its head by charging publication fees to the authors of research papers, and then making the content available for free.
I am interested in why the basic premise that the 9/11 attacks where not all that they seem causes so much anger. You have to remeber that JFK was presented with a similar plan by the CIA during the Cuban missle crisis, including hijacking civilian flights, in order to stir up feeling against the Cubans. Its seems to me that there are a lot of unanswered questions about the attacks, and a lot of the events of the day simply do not add up. I certainly would not put it past some of the nutjobs who were hanging around Bush at the time to present him with an updated version of the Cuban missle plan.
I am not surprised that felch jumps up and down he strikes me as being a bit of a tit.It is impossible unfortunatly to have any form of discussion on this forum without Alex and Felch shouting about trolls.
You shouldn't jump into threads without actually reading them through Karl. I know, that's expecting a lot from you. If you read it, you might have a clue that the issue is not questioning the official story - it's about fabricating bullshit to whip up hysteria, and on the side, turning it into a money spinning cottage business.
Great, we have another loon picking at scabs and pissing on graves.
I agree, 9-11 conspiracy theorists are anti-science idiots. Paranoid thinking is a sad spectacle to observe.
A one stop shop for these nutjobs (thanks John Done) -



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